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Thread: Proposal to means test free legal aid

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    Politics.ie Member jpc's Avatar
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    Default Proposal to means test free legal aid

    It seems some is waking up to the fact that many recidivist criminal are availing of free legal aid.
    Not only do they get a solicitor, but SC and JC if required.
    Very cursory examination of their ability is made if any.
    Its now proposed to check the PPS of anyone claiming free legal aid (FLA)
    Last year this cost 55 million euro.
    About time given some of the reprobates using this right frequently.
    Its only a chat, we ain't the world council.

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    Politics.ie Member corelli's Avatar
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    I don't think anyone will have much difficulty with this as long as it is reasonably applied. No matter how "recidivist" if an accused has insufficient means they are entitled to representation.
    "......... we must sometimes listen to those who, consumed with zeal, have scant judgment or balance. To such ones the modern world is nothing but betrayal and ruin.........We feel bound to disagree with these prophets of doom who are forever forecasting calamity -- as though the world's end were imminent."

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    Politics.ie Member dresden8's Avatar
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    What if they're a formerly rich developer who's 1.2 billion in the hole?

    Or an allegedly corrupt Iar-Thaoiseach whose brief has no faith in his capacity to pay any more, especially since his luck on the horses has run out?

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    Politics.ie Member jpc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by corelli View Post
    I don't think anyone will have much difficulty with this as long as it is reasonably applied. No matter how "recidivist" if an accused has insufficient means they are entitled to representation.
    It would depend on their activities.
    Why should the taxpayer pay for crims seen abroad on holiday or driving large cars.
    Its only a chat, we ain't the world council.

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    Politics.ie Member corelli's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jpc View Post
    It would depend on their activities.
    Why should the taxpayer pay for crims seen abroad on holiday or driving large cars.
    That would be included in any definition of reasonable. If they turn up to court is a big merc then there would be a presumption that they don't get legal aid.
    "......... we must sometimes listen to those who, consumed with zeal, have scant judgment or balance. To such ones the modern world is nothing but betrayal and ruin.........We feel bound to disagree with these prophets of doom who are forever forecasting calamity -- as though the world's end were imminent."

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    Politics.ie Member jpc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dresden8 View Post
    What if they're a formerly rich developer who's 1.2 billion in the hole?

    Or an allegedly corrupt Iar-Thaoiseach whose brief has no faith in his capacity to pay any more, especially since his luck on the horses has run out?
    The dudes you mention pay for their own representation.
    But its a fair point given the obstruction evident during the tribunerals by some individuals legal teams.
    Its only a chat, we ain't the world council.

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    Politics.ie Member jpc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by corelli View Post
    That would be included in any definition of reasonable. If they turn up to court is a big merc then there would be a presumption that they don't get legal aid.
    But what if they weren't so blatent, but it was known that they lived beyond their stated means?
    Who should the court direct to inquire?
    Garda, CAB, Social welfare?
    Its only a chat, we ain't the world council.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dresden8 View Post

    Or an allegedly corrupt Iar-Thaoiseach whose brief has no faith in his capacity to pay any more, especially since his luck on the horses has run out?
    You're forgetting his potential Man Booker Prize winning book due out in the next couple of months

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    Politics.ie Member corelli's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jpc View Post
    But what if they weren't so blatent, but it was known that they lived beyond their stated means?
    Who should the court direct to inquire?
    Garda, CAB, Social welfare?
    CAB would be the ideal one but they are insufficiently resourced. Social welfare would also be a good call. You could not, though, expect the Gardai to investigate such matters.
    "......... we must sometimes listen to those who, consumed with zeal, have scant judgment or balance. To such ones the modern world is nothing but betrayal and ruin.........We feel bound to disagree with these prophets of doom who are forever forecasting calamity -- as though the world's end were imminent."

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    Politics.ie Member jpc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by corelli View Post
    CAB would be the ideal one but they are insufficiently resourced. Social welfare would also be a good call. You could not, though, expect the Gardai to investigate such matters.
    Then again they would have the most relevant intelligence that could be presented.
    I know where you are leading (Donegal?) but how quickly could you get info from CAB or SW?
    Its only a chat, we ain't the world council.

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