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Thread: Public attitudes to Welsh & Irish - why the difference?

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    Default Public attitudes to Welsh & Irish - why the difference?

    A poll released today indicates that 47% of respondents would like to strengthen Welsh language legislation, 29% would not & 25% don't know.

    Now Welsh language legislation is already strong compared to Irish language legislation. For example it would be illegal to put up a road sign just in English, everyone has the right to be tried in a court of law in the language of his choice, the whole of the public sector is obliged to demonstrate a commitment to the 'equality of treatement principle'.

    The legislation that is being discussed at the moment would, among other thing, force large chunks of the private sector in Wales to provide bilingual services.

    Why are public attitudes so different?

    Or is it just my imagination?
    Poni welwch chi hynt y gwynt a'r glaw?
    Poni welwch chi'r deri'n ymdaraw?

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    Politics.ie Member Darren Mac an Phríora's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trefor1.1 View Post
    A poll released today indicates that 47% of respondents would like to strengthen Welsh language legislation, 29% would not & 25% don't know.

    Now Welsh language legislation is already strong compared to Irish language legislation. For example it would be illegal to put up a road sign just in English, everyone has the right to be tried in a court of law in the language of his choice, the whole of the public sector is obliged to demonstrate a commitment to the 'equality of treatement principle'.

    The legislation that is being discussed at the moment would, among other thing, force large chunks of the private sector in Wales to provide bilingual services.

    Why are public attitudes so different?

    Or is it just my imagination?
    Unless the 20 year plan for Irish to be announced soon (it should have been last December, then January) is good Irish will have been consigned by the Government as a token language outside of the Gaeltacht. Even Fáilte Ireland don't have a bilingual website.

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    Politics.ie Member White Horse's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trefor1.1 View Post
    A poll released today indicates that 47% of respondents would like to strengthen Welsh language legislation, 29% would not & 25% don't know.

    Now Welsh language legislation is already strong compared to Irish language legislation. For example it would be illegal to put up a road sign just in English, everyone has the right to be tried in a court of law in the language of his choice, the whole of the public sector is obliged to demonstrate a commitment to the 'equality of treatement principle'.

    The legislation that is being discussed at the moment would, among other thing, force large chunks of the private sector in Wales to provide bilingual services.

    Why are public attitudes so different?

    Or is it just my imagination?
    Is Welsh rammed down the throat of Welsh school children for their entire first and second level education?

    I think a large part of the antipathy towards Gaelic derives from the education system.

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    Quote Originally Posted by White Horse View Post
    Is Welsh rammed down the throat of Welsh school children for their entire first and second level education?

    I think a large part of the antipathy towards Gaelic derives from the education system.
    Welsh is compulsory up to 16.

    I wouldn't argue that the compulsion is effective, but it causes very little ill will.
    Poni welwch chi hynt y gwynt a'r glaw?
    Poni welwch chi'r deri'n ymdaraw?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Darren Mac an Phríora View Post
    Unless the 20 year plan for Irish to be announced soon (it should have been last December, then January) is good Irish will have been consigned by the Government as a token language outside of the Gaeltacht. Even Fáilte Ireland don't have a bilingual website.
    The interesting question is why attitudes differ?

    Here, people who have not one word of Welsh are as likely as not to support more legislation.
    Poni welwch chi hynt y gwynt a'r glaw?
    Poni welwch chi'r deri'n ymdaraw?

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    Yes, there is a marked difference in attitude between the Irish and the Welsh with regard to their native languages.
    Welsh nationalism evolves around Language, culture, tradition and a real pride in their country and being Welsh. i.e. real nationalism.
    Irish nationalism on the other hand is fake, it just merely evolves around a profound hatred of anything British or Anglican. It has little to do with Irish culture or language issues, indeed I've encountered several supposedly nationalistic individuals , and their loathing of the Irish language is equally matched by their animosity towards the British.
    If we were like the Welsh, i.e. imbued with a real sense of nationalism, the Irish language would not be in the sorry state it's in today.

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    Politics.ie Member Darren Mac an Phríora's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Deputy of Listowel View Post
    Yes, there is a marked difference in attitude between the Irish and the Welsh with regard to their native languages.
    Welsh nationalism evolves around Language, culture, tradition and a real pride in their country and being Welsh. i.e. real nationalism.
    Irish nationalism on the other hand is fake, it just merely evolves around a profound hatred of anything British or Anglican. It has little to do with the Irish culture or language issues, indeed I've encountered several supposedly nationalistic individuals , and their loathing of the Irish language is equally matched by their animosity towards the British.
    If we were like the Welsh, i.e. imbued with a real sense of nationalism, the Irish language would not be in the sorry state it's in today.
    Nationalism and patriotism to most people is childish- they have a childish outlook on it.

    Trefor1.1, we've debated the state of Irish in comparison to Welsh on this site in depth many times.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Deputy of Listowel View Post
    Yes, there is a marked difference in attitude between the Irish and the Welsh with regard to their native languages.
    Welsh nationalism evolves around Language, culture, tradition and a real pride in their country and being Welsh. i.e. real nationalism.
    Irish nationalism on the other hand is fake, it just merely evolves around a profound hatred of anything British or Anglican. It has little to do with Irish culture or language issues, indeed I've encountered several supposedly nationalistic individuals , and their loathing of the Irish language is equally matched by their animosity towards the British.
    If we were like the Welsh, i.e. imbued with a real sense of nationalism, the Irish language would not be in the sorry state it's in today.
    Welsh nationalism has a number of strands - cultural nationalism would be one, but there are others.
    Poni welwch chi hynt y gwynt a'r glaw?
    Poni welwch chi'r deri'n ymdaraw?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Trefor1.1 View Post
    A poll released today indicates that 47% of respondents would like to strengthen Welsh language legislation, 29% would not & 25% don't know.
    I thought Trefor did not believe in the findings of such polls.

    Or does he now take the results of the Northern Ireland Life and Times Survey, regarding attitudes of Catholics towards the Union, seriously?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Darren Mac an Phríora View Post
    Nationalism and patriotism to most people is childish- they have a childish outlook on it.

    Trefor1.1, we've debated the state of Irish in comparison to Welsh on this site in depth many times.
    Give us a one sentence synopsis then - why?
    Poni welwch chi hynt y gwynt a'r glaw?
    Poni welwch chi'r deri'n ymdaraw?

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