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Thread: BREXIT: the general forum (Second Thread)

  1. #12821
    Politics.ie Member FunkyBoogaloo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AhNowStop View Post
    Ah here, whether you agree or not Moscovici is the European Commissioner for Economic and Financial Affairs, Taxation and Customs ... a lot of the Brits said they had "had enough of experts" when this whole Brexit thing started and now they're saying they dont want to listen to business leaders and CEOs of multinational companies..... You simply cant just dismiss these people as Britain is finding out to its peril .. and it will only get worse.

    Im not sure what else to say in reply to your post as Im not quite sure what it is you actually think will happen or indeed want to see happening.. anyway, there ye go
    I can dismiss them, if I so choose. You don't have to like that but such is life.

    Muscovici is an incompetent and unelected charlatan who - as if to remind us all how things actually work in the EU - is quite prepared to break the rules when it comes to his home country. The big boys break the rules and a blind eye is turned, or the rules are changed. A smaller member state does the same and it's sanctions time. The EU is largely broken... and has been since the big boys started ignoring the rules of the S&G pact. Heck, even the populace don't lend it support... the majority can't be arsed to get out and vote for so-called "european democracy".

    I think the same of the UK as I always have - perfidious Albion. F.u.c.k the lot of them!

    What I think will happen is irrelevant. What I want is anarchy.
    Not getting notifications for quoted posts. If I don't respond to a quoted post of mine it's because I don't know it has been quoted.

  2. #12822
    Politics.ie Member galteeman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by firefly123 View Post
    Someone posted this article earlier. I only got around to reading it now.
    Very clear and concise account of things up to now.

    It's not good for the UK.
    At this stage we could probably squeeze more concessions out.
    The crown jewels?
    Big Ben?
    David Attenborough ?
    The unbroken one from Ant and Dec?
    Cromwells bones?
    The Tories don't seem willing to even discuss giving up NI so they can proceed with a real Brexit for the rest. I'm still not sure if it's genuine concern for the union or just the temporary reliance on DUP to stay in power.
    “to expect bad men not to do wrong is madness.” - Marcus Aurelius
    “Criminals thrive on the indulgence of society’s understanding.” - Henri Ducard

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  4. #12824
    Politics.ie Member Toland's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by galteeman View Post
    The Tories don't seem willing to even discuss giving up NI so they can proceed with a real Brexit for the rest. I'm still not sure if it's genuine concern for the union or just the temporary reliance on DUP to stay in power.
    Almost certainly the latter. They are no more than a pain in the neck to the Tories.

  5. #12825
    Politics.ie Member firefly123's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by galteeman View Post
    The Tories don't seem willing to even discuss giving up NI so they can proceed with a real Brexit for the rest. I'm still not sure if it's genuine concern for the union or just the temporary reliance on DUP to stay in power.
    Well in December last year they enthusiastically signed up to the backstop only to get a dose of ...er... patriotism thanks to the DUP.

    The UK is conservative constituencies as far as the Tory party is concerned
    Life is hard
    That's why no-one survives

  6. #12826
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    Brexit would go so much smoother if the Big Island Brits dump Northern Ireland on Leo .

    Poser Leo would be stuck in a Pose then .

  7. #12827
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    Tony Connelly analyses May's letter in his Twitter account. Basically, he's saying it's complete bullshìt because it contains so many contradictions and magical thinking. Below are just SOME of the highlights.

    Tony Connelly (@tconnellyRTE) | Twitter
    The opening is a bit confusing: “A Brussels plan to put a customs border in the Irish Sea if there is no Brexit agreement will be included in a divorce deal”.The idea of a No Brexit Agreement usually means No Divorce Deal, so it sounds contradictory: ie, if there’s no divorce deal we’ll have this in the divorce deal.

    May is saying that if the long term free trade negotiations are “unsuccessful” then the EU wants the NI-specific backstop to take over. That would indeed involve NI staying in the customs union and single market for goods. But what does “unsuccessful” mean? Does it mean the FTA negotiations break down? Or does it mean they don’t deliver the all important guarantee that there’s no need for customs or regulatory controls on the Irish border?

    May says: “I could not accept there being any circumstances or conditions in which that ‘backstop to the backstop’, which would break up the UK customs territory, could come in to force.” This is there to reassure the DUP, but it will not reassure Dublin or the EU.

    But London persisted, saying the TCA has to be legally binding in the Withdrawal Agreement, and not a “vague promise” in the Political Declaration which will accompany it. But here May seems to want to have her legal cake and eat it. On the one hand she’s arguing the “backstop” has to be temporary because Article 50 demands that it’s temporary (ie, Article 50 can’t “establish a permanent relationship”).

    She’s effectively throwing the EU’s own legal logic back at Brussels: the backstop (either the NI-specific one or the TCA) can’t be permanent because Article 50 is only a divorce treaty, not a future relationship treaty. And yet on the other hand London is asking Brussels to bend the rules so that the Article 50 Withdrawal Agreement *can* accommodate the UK-wide customs union, which is a future relationship issue.
    God alone knows what Barnier made of it.

  8. #12828
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    Quote Originally Posted by blinding View Post
    Brexit would go so much smoother if the Big Island Brits dump Northern Ireland on Leo .

    Poser Leo would be stuck in a Pose then .
    The only thing in keeping with the GFA is the Backstop, which is why all this talk of moving "the border" to the Irish Sea is deeply unhelpful. Sovereignty will not be touched, and it's unnecessary to play on sensitivities while unionism is on its uncomfortable back foot. Of course, this suits the DUPers.
    "It seems that mankind doesn't really have a passion for listening." - Jr. Gong, 2007.

  9. #12829
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    Quote Originally Posted by Prof Honeydew View Post
    Tony Connelly analyses May's letter in his Twitter account. Basically, he's saying it's complete bullshìt because it contains so many contradictions and magical thinking. Below are just SOME of the highlights.

    Tony Connelly (@tconnellyRTE) | Twitter


    God alone knows what Barnier made of it.
    This is why the EU must insist that what the British Govt signed up to in December 2017 must be honoured.
    If the British Govt refuse, then No Deal.
    if a No Deal scenario brings down the British Govt, then so be it - the EU deals with the next British Govt which must honour the December 2017 commitments.

    Otherwise, every time a British Govt changes, they will simply say that they are not bound by any commitments entered into by a previous British Govt - and that is totally unacceptable.
    " I was only a puppet, and so was Ulster and Ireland, in the political game that was to get the Tory Party into power. " - Eddie "the Gun Runner" Carson, 1921

  10. #12830
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    'Snearing'?

    How totally arrogant of me to know it is spelled differently.
    Brexit says: Nothing is agreed until nothing is agreed.

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