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Thread: Strategies for Uniting Ireland

  1. #1

    Default Strategies for Uniting Ireland

    As none of the parties seem to have clear ideas on this I decided to post this. Discounting military solutions and leaving aside demographic predictions, how best can we unite the people of Ireland? Also leave out the UK. heres what I thought of.

    1. Forget about the unionists and stay true to our own meaning of Irishness. They can join us or leave.
    2. Combine our culture with unionist culture and create a new Irish identity.
    3. Forget about identity, become west europeans hoping that in the future national identities will not mean anything and then we'll join together out of pure economic logic.
    4. Federalise ireland and let the unionists keep their own corner of Ireland, like a french speaking canton in Switzerland surrounded by german speaking cantons. Though we'd be one country again.


    How long do you think each of these options would take and how much chance do they have in succeding? What is the most likely and which would each party go for?

  2. #2
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    No 4 would be the best option

    In fact lets federalise the whole country -

    The PRC down south always want to run things - so let them on - and let those whinging gits in the West get their own parliament so the rest of us dont have to listen to them crying any longer.

    The Federal Republic of Ireland - bring it on!

  3. #3
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    It seems like a lot of trouble to go to and for what?

    You could always spend the same time and effort improving health, education, transport etc.

    Boundaries are a man-made illusion. Why not unite Ireland with Scotland while we're at it? Or Meath with Westmeath. And let's face it Europe isn't really a continent.

    Imagine you are seriously ill and you have to pick one from the 2 options below:
    (A) The health service has improved to the extent that you can get life-saving treatment in good time, while enjoying a comfortable stay
    (B) Inordinate delays lead to your suffering and death, but in a united Ireland.
    If there is a future, it will be Green.

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    Default Re: Strategies for Uniting Ireland

    Quote Originally Posted by huntergatherer
    As none of the parties seem to have clear ideas on this I decided to post this. Discounting military solutions and leaving aside demographic predictions, how best can we unite the people of Ireland? Also leave out the UK. heres what I thought of.

    1. Forget about the unionists and stay true to our own meaning of Irishness. They can join us or leave.
    2. Combine our culture with unionist culture and create a new Irish identity.
    3. Forget about identity, become west europeans hoping that in the future national identities will not mean anything and then we'll join together out of pure economic logic.
    4. Federalise ireland and let the unionists keep their own corner of Ireland, like a french speaking canton in Switzerland surrounded by german speaking cantons. Though we'd be one country again.


    How long do you think each of these options would take and how much chance do they have in succeding? What is the most likely and which would each party go for?





    Allow me to be the first to point out that Republican Sinn Féin advocate your fourth point, so that discounts your bold claim that only you have clear ideas on a united Ireland. (Btw, I'm not a member or supporter of Sinn Féin Poblacht, but respect them)

    As for a 'United Ireland', well the simple solution is for the Brits to pull out.
    But for many, including new members of Sinn Féin (Parnell Square), a united Ireland is simply a concept of shoving Free State political structures into the 6 counties, and 'absorbing' a united Ireland; one by stealth, i.e. same tax rates etc..

    To my mind, as a non-aligned Republican, a united Ireland is worth nothing if there is no social change. Both British created parliaments on this island must be dissolved, and a new national parliament created, with the ordinary people sovereign - not the sleaze or gombeenism rampant in 26 county politics, or the blatant sectarianism of 6 county politics.

    How this is achieved has long been debated within republican circles. But I think a good first step is for England to relinquish her illegal hold of 6 Irish counties.
    Meon na saoirse.

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    Default Re: Strategies for Uniting Ireland

    Quote Originally Posted by huntergatherer
    2. Combine our culture with unionist culture and create a new Irish identity.
    3. Forget about identity, become west europeans hoping that in the future national identities will not mean anything and then we'll join together out of pure economic logic.

    so step 2 is create a new identity and step 3 (the very next step) is the forget about identity ?

    that's some level of inefficiency and wasted time and effort, tell me are you a manager in the HSE also ?
    Enda Kenny on FF government: “We’re in this mess, not because Fianna Fáil policies have failed, but because they have succeeded.”

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    Default Re: Strategies for Uniting Ireland

    Quote Originally Posted by drbob1972
    Quote Originally Posted by huntergatherer
    2. Combine our culture with unionist culture and create a new Irish identity.
    3. Forget about identity, become west europeans hoping that in the future national identities will not mean anything and then we'll join together out of pure economic logic.

    so step 2 is create a new identity and step 3 (the very next step) is the forget about identity ?

    that's some level of inefficiency and wasted time and effort, tell me are you a manager in the HSE also ?
    These are options he is given, not a progression of steps.
    "Only by applying the most rigorous standards do we pay writing in Irish the supreme compliment of taking it seriously." - Breandán Ó Doibhlín.

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    The GFA gave the people the democratic tools to adapt the institutions as they see fit. Trying to be too precise about the future won't work - who could have foreseen that the DUP would be the unionist party which was able to do the business after those nice moderates in the UUP tied themselves into knots trying to invent new pre-conditions?

    Things will work themselves out. Most unionists believe that NI gainss an advantage by being part of the UK system while most nationalists would claim that there are practical advantages to treating the island of Ireland as one unit.

    With the two communities in the North approaching parity it will be the approach which is most useful on the ground which wins, and if there have to be compromises on both sides maybe that isn't such a bad thing.

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    Default Re: Strategies for Uniting Ireland

    Quote Originally Posted by 32
    As for a 'United Ireland', well the simple solution is for the Brits to pull out.
    But for many, including new members of Sinn Féin (Parnell Square), a united Ireland is simply a concept of shoving Free State political structures into the 6 counties, and 'absorbing' a united Ireland; one by stealth, i.e. same tax rates etc..

    To my mind, as a non-aligned Republican, a united Ireland is worth nothing if there is no social change. Both British created parliaments on this island must be dissolved, and a new national parliament created, with the ordinary people sovereign - not the sleaze or gombeenism rampant in 26 county politics, or the blatant sectarianism of 6 county politics.

    How this is achieved has long been debated within republican circles. But I think a good first step is for England to relinquish her illegal hold of 6 Irish counties.
    The overly simplistic and naive "Brits Out" solution doesn't solve the question of over half the population of Northern Ireland considering themselves to be and being in fact British citizens. Would you propose to force them off the island of Ireland if they do not accept an imposed citizenship of a "United Ireland".
    A united Ireland arrived at by agreement and consent of the people of Northern Ireland is the only viable and legal solution to the possibility of a united Ireland in the short but more likely long term.

    Do you mean "with the ordinary people sovereign" that the politicians and Governments elected would just be those you agree with, it appears to me the "ordinary people of Ireland" have proved in many elections, local, general, European and constitutional referenda that they are sovereign and just because you, I or and any group of citizens doesn't agree with the choice of politicians or Governments sometimes elected or decisions made, it doesn't mean that the electorate didn't use their franchise freely to elect the politicians and Governments they wanted.
    "You want fame? Well, fame costs. And right here is where you start paying........"

  9. #9

    Default Re: Strategies for Uniting Ireland

    Quote Originally Posted by 32
    Quote Originally Posted by huntergatherer
    As none of the parties seem to have clear ideas on this I decided to post this. Discounting military solutions and leaving aside demographic predictions, how best can we unite the people of Ireland? Also leave out the UK. heres what I thought of.

    1. Forget about the unionists and stay true to our own meaning of Irishness. They can join us or leave.
    2. Combine our culture with unionist culture and create a new Irish identity.
    3. Forget about identity, become west europeans hoping that in the future national identities will not mean anything and then we'll join together out of pure economic logic.
    4. Federalise ireland and let the unionists keep their own corner of Ireland, like a french speaking canton in Switzerland surrounded by german speaking cantons. Though we'd be one country again.


    How long do you think each of these options would take and how much chance do they have in succeding? What is the most likely and which would each party go for?





    Allow me to be the first to point out that Republican Sinn Féin advocate your fourth point, so that discounts your bold claim that only you have clear ideas on a united Ireland. (Btw, I'm not a member or supporter of Sinn Féin Poblacht, but respect them)
    I meant major parties (those with at least seats), but at least Sinn Fein Poblacht have a strategy which is more than can be said of any other party in Ireland. Why is that? Personally I would opt for 4 myself.

  10. #10

    Default

    Pay for building a motorway and improved rail system Dublin - Belfast
    Abandon National Spatial Strategy in favour of developing the Dublin - Belfast corridor
    Use the Irish language (otherwise why bother with "Ireland" anyway)

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