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Thread: European Court of Justice rules in favour of Waterford workers pensions

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    Politics.ie Member Burnout's Avatar
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    Default European Court of Justice rules in favour of Waterford workers pensions

    This has just been released and there is little info on it at the moment bar the fact that the Irish Government should have stepped in at at the bankruptcy stage of the company where the pension pot did'nt add up to the full amount. I think 10 workers were involved in the case and was brought after an english lady won her case. It could secure them €2.6m in pension entitlements — and many millions more for thousands of other Irish workers. [edit: 26 APRIL 2013. THE State faces having to find up to €200m to compensate Waterford Crystal workers for the loss of their pension benefits].

    "...Much of their claim rests on the case of English woman Carol Robins who successfully took the British government to court over a similar double insolvency.She had only received 49% of her pension, considerably more than the Waterford employees are expecting."

    When the matter was brought before the Commercial Court the workers said the State had failed to meet its obligations under the EU Insolvency Directive to “protect” workers whose employers become insolvent. Department of Finance Kevin Cardiff (where is he now) said it was not possible for the Government to guarantee either the €13bn actuarial cost of full pension entitlements in insolvency situations or the lesser unspecified cost of paying less than 100% of the entitlements of persons still working at the time of insolvency. So Kevin was wrong again and there he is making a fortune abroad making more decisions.
    Last edited by Burnout; 26th April 2013 at 09:50 AM.

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    Last edited by Congalltee; 25th April 2013 at 11:05 AM. Reason: My correction was correct. I amend my errors.

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    Dylan2010
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    I dont understand it, most pension funds are in deficit , is everyone without pensions now meant to shore them up via taxes?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Burnout View Post
    This has just been released and there is little info on it at the moment bar the fact that the Irish Government should have stepped in at at the bankruptcy stage of the company where the pension pot did'nt add up to the full amount. I think 10 workers were involved in the case and was brought after an english lady won her case. It could secure them €2.6m in pension entitlements — and many millions more for thousands of other Irish workers.

    "...Much of their claim rests on the case of English woman Carol Robins who successfully took the British government to court over a similar double insolvency.She had only received 49% of her pension, considerably more than the Waterford employees are expecting."

    When the matter was brought before the Commercial Court the workers said the State had failed to meet its obligations under the EU Insolvency Directive to “protect” workers whose employers become insolvent. Department of Finance Kevin Cardiff (where is he now) said it was not possible for the Government to guarantee either the €13bn actuarial cost of full pension entitlements in insolvency situations or the lesser unspecified cost of paying less than 100% of the entitlements of persons still working at the time of insolvency. So kevin was wrong again and there he is making a fortune abroad making more decisions.
    It's a ruling by the ECJ not the ECHR.

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    Politics.ie Member Clanrickard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dylan2010 View Post
    I dont understand it, most pension funds are in deficit , is everyone without pensions now meant to shore them up via taxes?
    There is an EU directive requiring the state to make sure workers are protected. The state didn't do it. Not sure of the specifics.

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    Dylan2010
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    Quote Originally Posted by Clanrickard View Post
    There is an EU directive requiring the state to make sure workers are protected. The state didn't do it. Not sure of the specifics.
    it would sound like at the nearest whiff of a deficit then, the gov would be forced to close down these companies "to protect the workers". This doesnt sound any different from the state bailing out Anglo where no insurance fund exists or has been built up.

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    Politics.ie Member Howya's Avatar
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    Will this give companies an incentive not to fund DB schemes as they know the State will have to bailout the pensioners - what sort of incentive is that?
    “Still paying, still to owe. Eternal woe! ” ― Paradise Lost, John Milton

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    GDPR Deleted
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    If Europe thinks so, let Europe fund it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Astral Peaks View Post
    Can the thread title be edited, it is seriously misleading and plain factually wrong?

    It is the European Court of Justice, not the ECHR.
    V
    Mods don't do that type of thing unless the OP delivers a parchment with ink made from pig's blood requesting them to do so, giving an indemnity to pie media ltd and expressing a thousand apologies. But they will not act on their own initiative.

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    Politics.ie Member Astral Peaks's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tonic View Post
    If Europe thinks so, let Europe fund it.
    What part of Ireland agreeing to be bound by European Directives is so difficult for you to understand?

    Seeking to deflect from something?

    Let me guess, who was in office at the time? Would it have been your hero, by any chance?

    Who failed to ensure Ireland lived up to it's obligations under the Directive? Fianna Fail, perhaps?
    "Don't need a whore, I don't need no booze, don't need a virgin priest."

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