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Thread: Recent events in the six counties and their ongoing significance for the country

  1. #1
    Politics.ie Member Estragon's Avatar
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    Default Recent events in the six counties and their ongoing significance for the country

    I'm signing off p.ie after this. Before that I wanted to put down a few points for consideration.

    Earlier this year we had the Solemn Ulster Covenant celebrations. The response to this and analysis offered in the media was largely uncritical.

    What the Covenant was all about was a subversion of democracy.

    A few short months later and we have Belfast City Council taking a democratic vote. The Unionist response was predictable. It is the way Unionists always respond in situations like this. They resort to violence. It is the survival reflex which has served them so eminently down the centuries.
    Again, we are seeing little critical analysis of this subversion of democracy in the media. In point of fact we are being treated to hand-wringing pieces where journos head into east Belfast and Sandy Row trying to 'understand' the misunderstood Unionist.

    What we hear is a lot of crap about Unionists feeling their identity is under seige. Is this what your identity is? Shoving the union jack down the throat of a city that doesn't want it? Actually, that is precisely what it is. They certainly don't want a tricolour on top of city hall alongside the union jack. They don't want equality, they want dominance. That was the very foundation of the six county entity.

    When we think of some of the sickening crap Unionists have pulled in city hall down the years, their reaction to this has been simultaneously predictable and hilarious. It has made the sight of that bare flag pole all the sweeter.

    Folks in the 26 counties may labour under the illusion that this is of no relevance to them.

    The remorseless shift in demography begs to differ.

    I have said previously that the greatest assurance of a united Ireland is that Unionists just keep on being Unionists.

    What the past few days have seen is an object demonstration that Unionists just can't help being Unionists. That instinctive hatred of Fenians is just too sodden in their marrow for them to allow reason and cool political calculation to trump their need for violence and bloodlust when confronted with Catholics getting 'beyond their station'.

    Many commentators on the census have comforted themselves with the delusion that half these Catholics are really green Brits. Perhaps that's the case, but I can tell you this, I've yet to come across a Catholic who isn't quite pleased to see that flag down. And it’s just a sign of things to come.

    As the Nationalist proportion of the population passes out the Unionist, then they will feel less and less obligated to put up with the innumerable signs of Unionists domination we have shoved down our throat day and daily. Why should they? They're running the show. If they want to name streets after Daniel O'Connell, who's going to stop them? If they want to fund huge St Patrick's day festivities who's going to stop them? If they want to give more grants to the GAA than they do to soccer, who's going to stop them? If a majority Catholic police force starts making life difficult in East Belfast, who exactly is going to cry tears over it?

    These are just a few examples off the top of my head of what an ever more nationalist six counties hold in store for unionism. A lot of it will only be a leveling of the playing field. But as unionism has amply demonstrated they are totally incapable of dealing with that without resorting to violence.

    The flag on City Hall is just the thinnest end of the wedge. There is much, much more where that came from.

    And how does this have relevance for the average denizen of the 26 counties?

    Having seen the reaction to a fairly trivial recognition of demographic realities in Belfast, it does not take much imagination to project that coming years hold in store a steady rise of tensions in the six counties.

    Now here is the key point.

    Unionists will be Unionists. They will be seeking to bring violence into the equation at every perceived provocation. Little comprehending that in doing so they are turning soft Catholic opinion against the union. By constantly resorting to violence Unionists will make it abundantly clear to those Catholics not already switched on to the fact, that Unionist don't consider a six counties where they are EQUAL to Nationalists worth living in. That was never the point of the six counties.

    As violence escalates frightened and newly politicised Nationalists will be faced with a two choices, both of which will be grim for Unionism.

    1. They use the organs of the state, which they will then dominate, to treat unionists just as they treated nationalists throughout the Troubles.

    2. They vote the six counties into a united Ireland to definitively secure their safety.

    Ironically, the way things are going and current patterns of behaviour, the best unionism can now hope for is a United Ireland.

    The 26 counties need to pay very careful attention to what is happening in the six counites, for this is an issue that will only play ever increasing importance in the political dialogue of the island. The government needs to be planning now for both eventualities. Part of that should see a realistic discussion started in society about how we deal with a majority nationalist six counties and unionism in a tailspin towards civil war.

    The section 31 policy on this site is stupid, bone-headed, duplicitous, amoral and anti-intellectual. But it is perhaps in facilitating and fomenting ignorance on what will become a defining political development of our generation that its greatest folly lies.

    When the policy is dropped I'll return. Until then, I'll sit back and enjoy the slow turn of the screw.
    We are all born mad. Some remain so.

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    Politics.ie Member McTell's Avatar
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    You have a small number on each "side" in NI who are hardly educated and a good number of tv crews looking for a story, that's all. In the good ole US of A they would all be labelled (or labeled) as white trash.
    McTell tCurrently, I am missing certain information. That has been requested and will be added as soon as it is available available availableavailable

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    It is time to build a Colosseum in Belfast and confine all tribal combat to fixed times with some kind of rule structure.

    Sky would pay a fortune for the TV rights which might draw as many viewers as the Premiership!

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    Politics.ie Member Cruimh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Estragon View Post

    The remorseless shift in demography begs to differ.
    What a mopetastic whining flounce!

    The shift in demography? petunia

    Sure enough, the new census shows that, since 2001, the number who are or who were brought up as Protestant has dropped by 5 per cent to a total of 48 per cent – making them a minority for the first time. Meanwhile, the equivalent figure for Catholics is up 1 per cent, to 45 per cent.
    The key point, however, is that being a Catholic no longer dictates your political allegiance. Asked to select one or more identities, 48 per cent of Northern Ireland’s inhabitants chose British, 29 per cent Northern Irish and only 28 per cent Irish. Anyone born in Northern Ireland has the right to opt for an Irish passport, yet only a fifth do: by contrast, three fifths hold a UK passport. Last year, a survey showed that, while only 4 per cent of Protestants want a united Ireland, more than half of Catholics prefer to stay in the UK.

    Some shift

    And I suspect it is why you are retiring to sulk.

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    Politics.ie Member Victor Meldrew's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by McTell View Post
    You have a small number on each "side" in NI who are hardly educated and a good number of tv crews looking for a story, that's all. In the good ole US of A they would all be labelled (or labeled) as white trash.
    Actually, that is an insult to Cletus and his wife/sister and their 10 little 'uns. In fact, it is probably an insult to his cousin Billy-Bob what done cuts dem holes in that dar bed sheet.

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    Politics.ie Member ruserious's Avatar
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    I think people in the Republic have enough to be worried about than the incessant whinnings of Nordies. If ye want to stay in the Union or join the Republic, sort it out on the quiet yourselves and when ye have an answer, let us down here know and we'll vote on it then if we can afford ye.
    Bye.
    Boycott the "Irish" Sun rag.

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    Politics.ie Member former wesleyan's Avatar
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    Amazing how a thousand soreheads become " the unionists ".
    "What Michael Collins accepted in '22,De Valera accepted in'27 and Gerry Adams accepted in '98.Sooner or later they all come around to accepting the Treaty"

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    Politics.ie Member between the bridges's Avatar
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    99.9% of unionists haven't protested about the fleg and are obviously not too bothered, the fact that, that fact escapes most CNINR posters on here says more about them than anything i can.The census show us that 75% of those resident in N.I are happy with the status quo, with contiguous normalization and social integration this figure will increase... 32 county republicanism is on it's last legs, tick tock...
    Nec Aspera Terrent..Is Tuaisceart-Éireannach mé. Má tá meas agat ar mo chultúr, beidh meas agam ar do chultúr.

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    Politics.ie Member Analyzer's Avatar
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    Estragon, I presume that you are a Northern Nationalist, with SF leanings.

    The biggest problem that SF faces, when it demands that Northerners join with the south, is the fact that the 26 county state has descended into a hellhole in the last twenty years.

    This is not an issue of religion, or national feelings.

    Quite simply the Dublin regime has become corrupt, compromised, incompetent, and often outright embarrassing.

    How else could you explain the antagonism that exists in border areas towards Dublin ?

    In other words, northerners, on the whole, are now less convinced than ever of the merits of joining the south.

    And that is something that the institutional state in the south must take responsibility for. The sceptics are right. We were a Free State. And for a while we were a Republic. We descended into a mildly Fascistic state around 1987 when CJH decided to allow the bosses of oligopolistic players in IBEC and union fat cats to have a say in the running of the state. We became a less free state in a series of stages, staring with the Maastricht Treaty about the same time.

    In essence, an increasing number of Northerners are realising that liberty in the South is a facade. Equality is an excuse for more extortion from those that work hard. Democracy is a fig leaf for lies to the people like the Five Point Pla - as plump bunny said about how he says certain things to get elected. And the state itself is rotting. It cannot even be called a Free State anymore. It is no longer free. Just look at the behaviour of government ministers evertime Barrosso farts.

    Estragon, all I can recommend is that you make sure that your own personal liberty and freedom are protected. And that your families welfare is accounted for. Put that first, in an honourable way. Because we are governed by shysters who put it first in a dishonourable manner.
    Coveney's ambition is the be Ireland's next EU Commissar and Ireland will pay a price as he builds his CV to position himself sufficiently loyal to the nEU empire.

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    Politics.ie Member Mackers's Avatar
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    The problem with the latest row about the flying of the flag is someone in Unionist land came up with a big idea in the form of 40000 leaflets attacking the Alliance Party. In that leaflet they lit a fuse that exploded in their faces.

    Here's the deal the Belfast City Council is paid for by the rate payers of that city. This means that what goes on in it is the sole responsibility of those said rate payers. Some time back in an election the people in it's baliwick went to the bother to vote and with that as a fact changed the times when the flag in question is flown. Ergo there is no way protests violent or not can be allowed to usurp this democratic decision. To let this be the case would be both wrong and dangerous for everyone.
    War doesn't work. Give peace a chance.

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