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Thread: Clare Daly's Abortion Bill - Do you know what's in it?

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    Politics.ie Member Half Nelson's Avatar
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    Default Clare Daly's Abortion Bill - Do you know what's in it?

    The proposed legislation, which will very shortly be discussed and voted on, has the potential to have far-reaching consequences, so perhaps we should acquaint ourselves with what it contains. It doesn't limit itself to the provision of abortion but includes sections to carry out abortion without consent, provide abortions to children without parental consent and to attack pro-life opponents.

    2.8.3: The consent of the woman shall be required for treatment
    except where, in the opinion of the medical practitioner responsible
    for her care and treatment, the treatment is necessary to safeguard
    her life and she is incapable of or is obstructed in giving such consent.

    This assumes that every mother would prefer to let her child die in order that she might live. We know that is not the case.
    ...........

    2.8.4: The consent of a minor who has attained the age of 16 years
    to medical treatment which, in the absence of consent, would constitute
    a trespass to her person, shall be as effective as it would be if
    she were of full age; and where a minor has by virtue of this subsection
    given an effective consent to medical treatment it shall not be
    necessary to obtain any consent for it from her parent or guardian.

    Parents won't be allowed to protect their children.

    ...........

    3.11 In the case of a person who, with a view to compel another
    to abstain from doing which that other has a lawful right to do under
    this Act, wrongfully and without lawful authority—
    (d) watches or besets the premises or other place where that
    other resides, works or carries on business, or happens to
    be, or the approach to such premises or place,..
    if that person is found guilty of an offence under section 9 of the Act
    of 1997, the court shall take such conduct into account as an aggravating
    factor in determining any sentence to be imposed on him or 10
    her for the offence.

    So, no pickets.
    Clare obviously couldn't resist a go at the opposition... and free speech.

    All this and more -
    http://www.oireachtas.ie/documents/b...12/b10312d.pdf

    /MOD/ This thread merged here: http://www.politics.ie/showthread.ph...1149&p=6088316 /MOD/
    Last edited by Sync; 27th November 2012 at 09:04 PM.

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    Politics.ie Member Half Nelson's Avatar
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    Section 2.7 claims to allow conscientious dissent for medical personnel but then goes on to make such dissent virtually impossible in certain circumstances.

    No individual directly involved in the provision of medical
    treatment governed by this Act shall be under a duty or be placed
    under a duty, whether by contract or otherwise, to participate in the
    provision of such medical treatment if he or she has an honestly held
    and reasonable objection to so doing—

    provided that..
    provided that...

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    Half Nelson - Not ANOTHER abortion thread please - pretty please
    “That which can be asserted without evidence, can be dismissed without evidence.” - Christopher Hitchens

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    Politics.ie Member Half Nelson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grey Area View Post
    Half Nelson - Not ANOTHER abortion thread please - pretty please
    I wouldn't normally but this is about impending legislation, which afaik hasn't been discussed and imho is far more important and relevant that most of what has been posted here.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Half Nelson View Post
    I wouldn't normally but this is about impending legislation, which afaik hasn't been discussed and imho is far more important and relevant that most of what has been posted here.
    Suppose you may have a point.
    “That which can be asserted without evidence, can be dismissed without evidence.” - Christopher Hitchens

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    Politics.ie Member Half Nelson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grey Area View Post
    Suppose you may have a point.
    You have a big interest in legal matters, don't you?

    I'm looking forward to your opinion.

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    Politics.ie Member Cellach's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Half Nelson View Post
    The proposed legislation, which will very shortly be discussed and voted on, has the potential to have far-reaching consequences, so perhaps we should acquaint ourselves with what it contains. It doesn't limit itself to the provision of abortion but includes sections to carry out abortion without consent, provide abortions to children without parental consent and to attack pro-life opponents.

    2.8.3: The consent of the woman shall be required for treatment
    except where, in the opinion of the medical practitioner responsible
    for her care and treatment, the treatment is necessary to safeguard
    her life and she is incapable of or is obstructed in giving such consent.

    This assumes that every mother would prefer to let her child die in order that she might live. We know that is not the case.
    It also protects the right to life of a woman who is unconscious. If a woman is unconscious, then we should assume that she wants her life to be saved unless she has stated otherwise in one fashion or the other. Surely this makes sense to you?


    Quote Originally Posted by Half Nelson View Post
    2.8.4: The consent of a minor who has attained the age of 16 years
    to medical treatment which, in the absence of consent, would constitute
    a trespass to her person, shall be as effective as it would be if
    she were of full age; and where a minor has by virtue of this subsection
    given an effective consent to medical treatment it shall not be
    necessary to obtain any consent for it from her parent or guardian.

    Parents won't be allowed to protect their children.

    ...........
    From what?

    Quote Originally Posted by Half Nelson View Post
    3.11 In the case of a person who, with a view to compel another
    to abstain from doing which that other has a lawful right to do under
    this Act, wrongfully and without lawful authority—
    (d) watches or besets the premises or other place where that
    other resides, works or carries on business, or happens to
    be, or the approach to such premises or place,..
    if that person is found guilty of an offence under section 9 of the Act
    of 1997, the court shall take such conduct into account as an aggravating
    factor in determining any sentence to be imposed on him or 10
    her for the offence.

    So, no pickets.
    Clare obviously couldn't resist a go at the opposition... and free speech.
    How is this an attack on free speech? Free speech is already qualified. You don't have a right to free speech in many areas. In addition, this is already in the statute books.

    Non-Fatal Offences Against the Person Act, 1997, Section 9

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    Moderator Cato's Avatar
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    It's highly unlikely that this Bill will be accepted by the Dáil.
    “I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty, than those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson (yeah, I'm aware of the irony)

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    Politics.ie Member Mountaintop's Avatar
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    You do know that, irrespective of it's content, it will be voted down, right?

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    Politics.ie Member Ulster-Lad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cato View Post
    It's highly unlikely that this Bill will be accepted by the Dáil.
    They rejected it once already.
    ‘The Great only appear great because we are on our knees: Let Us Rise!’ “ (James Larkin)

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