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Thread: Irish government spending well over half the economy-Bertie's "socialism" achieved!

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    Default Irish government spending well over half the economy-Bertie's "socialism" achieved!

    Thanks to Bertie's "socialist" legacy,Irish government spending is well over half the economy at 56%,comparable to the EU's most elaborate welfare states such as Scandinavia and France. CSO figures for 2009 show government spending of €75 billion and GNP of €131 billion.

    Given Ireland's rather shoddy welfare state services in comparison to France and Scandinavia,an appropriate spend would be about 40% of GNP at best or spending of €52 billion,requiring cuts of nearly one third.

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    Why did you put socialist in quotes?
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    There's a heck of a difference between Socialism and Populism.

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    Quote Originally Posted by FakeViking View Post
    There's a heck of a difference between Socialism and Populism.
    He was a populistic socialist or maybe a socialistic populist???
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mossy Heneberry View Post
    He was a populistic socialist or maybe a socialistic populist???
    'I'm a socialist' is a good populist line for a Man of the People. Ahern himself wouldn't recognise socialism if it came up and shook hands. Ken Loach's description is the most apt: "a cheap, right-wing politician".
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    This should help sharpen the minds of people who think we need stimulus spending: we already have it,and it hasn't worked.
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    Politics.ie Member wombat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by patslatt View Post
    Thanks to Bertie's "socialist" legacy,
    Bertie was a cronyist. FF has been similar to the Peronistas in Argentina and the PRI in Mexico, loads of popular policies to cover up the real purpose - feathering the nests of the well connected.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bboruimhe View Post
    'I'm a socialist' is a good populist line for a Man of the People. Ahern himself wouldn't recognise socialism if it came up and shook hands. Ken Loach's description is the most apt: "a cheap, right-wing politician".
    Right wing me hole. Next you'll be telling me he was a capitalist. A man that jumped into to bed with the socialist unions and sooked their cocks until they ran dry.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mossy Heneberry View Post
    Right wing me hole. Next you'll be telling me he was a capitalist. A man that jumped into to bed with the socialist unions and sooked their cocks until they ran dry.
    Crudely put and not accurate. What he was mostly was a Bertieist, believing the pursuit of his own wealth and popularity to be the national good. He did cave in to benchmarking, again for his own popularity. For all other issues, Ahern privatised. Every minister in his cabinet was ordered to out-source every service they could. Look at the mania for PPPs. But above all, he smiled and winked for the cameras while Mary Harney set out with a vengeance to destroy the public health service. I'll never forgive him for that.
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    Quote Originally Posted by patslatt View Post
    Thanks to Bertie's "socialist" legacy,Irish government spending is well over half the economy at 56%,comparable to the EU's most elaborate welfare states such as Scandinavia and France. CSO figures for 2009 show government spending of €75 billion and GNP of €131 billion.

    Given Ireland's rather shoddy welfare state services in comparison to France and Scandinavia,an appropriate spend would be about 40% of GNP at best or spending of €52 billion,requiring cuts of nearly one third.
    You make a good point. Government ministers regularly refer to the fiscal position as €50bn in spending and €30bn in revenue whereas in fact it is €75bn in gross spending.

    Budget documents often feature an item called Net Supply Services expenditure, which is below Gross spending by an amount corresponding to the direct revenues of Government departments, or so-called Appropriations in Aid. The biggest of these is PRSI receipts. This net/gross distinction is a regular source of confusion.

    At €75bn in spending there is massive scope for it to be reduced and to mitigate the crowding out effects on the private sector.

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