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Thread: Example of make work inefficiency in the Public Sector

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    Politics.ie Member cyberianpan's Avatar
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    Default Example of make work inefficiency in the Public Sector

    Today I received a "National Employment Survey 2009 Employee Questionaire". I am obliged by statute to fill it out. Now I agree these statistics are valuable, however the collection method

    1) Print and post me the form
    2) Me to fill out
    3) Post it back
    4) CSO staff to scan it in (manually typing if necessary)

    Is from the 1980's. Simple fact is that anyone who needs to can get web access. Yet the PS resist any change, their excuse for this one is likely a bleeding heart variant of
    "Well not everyone has Internet access"
    Fact is that these days it is more incovenient for most people to get postal access.

    cYp
    "Yawn , am I alive yet ?"

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    Politics.ie Member Telemachus's Avatar
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    An optional internet form would make sense.

    A lot of people arent computer literate and have no intention of becoming so.
    ..the Irish nation can become other than white, by privileging the voices of the racialised and subverting state immigration but also integration policies. – Ronit Lentin

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    Politics.ie Member johndodger's Avatar
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    Yet another "lets bash and blame the public sector workers for everything and leave FF and their banker and developer friends off the hook" thread.

    What makes you think the CSO is typical of the Public Service?

    Have you asked the CSO why they are using this method? It is concievable that there are legitimate plausable reasons for it.

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    Politics.ie Member Podolski1.5's Avatar
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    Firstly you're assuming that everybody is computer literate. It's one thing being able to get access to a computer at a local internet café, but what about those who have never used a computer.

    Secondly you seem to think this is a malaise of the public service. This assumes that usage of paper is a thing of the past in the private sector. Hardly.

    Thirdly this "National Employment Survey" was an invention of government in an attempt to massage unemployment downwards.

    The public service and the wider public sector is a diverse group of people at different levels doing many different jobs. It contains senior managerial figures who in many cases are government hacks, but the majority of its staff are ordinary workers, quite a lot of them on lower pay than those in the private sector.

    It's the usual lazy practice of tarring everyone in the public sector with the same dirty brush.
    "The rich always betray the poor"- Henry Joy McCracken

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    Quote Originally Posted by johndodger View Post
    It is concievable that there are legitimate plausable reasons for it.
    No it is not conceivable that there are any "plausible" reasons for it. I'm sure the CSO will come up with a list of "reasons" none of them plausible to anyone who has to account for the money they spend.

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    i work in the private sector but i have close family in the public sector so I think i understand some bit of both sides. The inefficiency in the public sector is phenomenal BUT it's not caused by the majority of workers in the public sector, it's because none of them have the power to change the system and decisions just get bounced from one person to another, SO my suggestion is to cut the obscene salaries of the upper echelons of management and bring in a full and fundamental review of systems, to include the staff suggestions (who could probably tell you more of the inefficiencies in their area than any daft consultant), then we'll see. It's not the majority of workers in the public sector that need to change, it's the heads at the top. In theory, the Croke park agreement should be ripped up and the efficiencies imposed anyway but all that will happen in that case is that those on cushy numbers will be left alone and the regular staff penalised.

    I cant start a thread and apologies if there is one somewhere, but I would love to get one started of stories from people that are/were inside the public sector of the most daft and inefficient things they have come across.
    Last edited by PollPot; 28th October 2010 at 11:50 AM.

  7. #7

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    I believe this form is for employers i.e. business owners and sole traders. If a business owner or sole trader can't use a computer for basic data input in 2010 I would be very surprised. Access may be an issue but in those cases people can decide to post. Problem is that if this form is put out for public tender to consultants it will probably end up costing millions or 10's of millions to implement unless managed very well with a good contract and onus on the consultants. I agree that the front line staff should be allowed to promote efficiencies. However the marxists in the unions don't like staff having "ideas" and getting their fellow workers to change their ways for the good of the customer.

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    SurveyMonkey: Free online survey software & questionnaire tool

    there. Do i get 10% of the cost saving of millions as a reward?

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    Politics.ie Member powderfinger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PollPot View Post
    i work in the private sector but i have close family in the public sector so I think i understand some bit of both sides. The inefficiency in the public sector is phenomenal BUT it's not caused by the majority of workers in the public sector, it's because none of them have the power to change the system and decisions just get bounced from one person to another, SO my suggestion is to cut the obscene salaries of the upper echelons of management and bring in a full and fundamental review of systems, to include the staff suggestions (who could probably tell you more of the inefficiencies in their area than any daft consultant), then we'll see. It's not the majority of workers in the public sector that need to change, it's the heads at the top. In theory, the Croke park agreement should be ripped up and the efficiencies imposed anyway but all that will happen in that case is that those on cushy numbers will be left alone and the regular staff penalised.

    I cant start a thread and apologies if there is one somewhere, but I would love to get one started of stories from people that are/were inside the public sector of the most daft and inefficient things they have come across.
    You could add to the thread below from last year Pollpot.
    http://www.politics.ie/economy/11190...t-fiction.html

  10. #10

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    Quote Originally Posted by cyberianpan View Post
    Today I received a "National Employment Survey 2009 Employee Questionaire". I am obliged by statute to fill it out.

    Simple fact is that anyone who needs to can get web access. Yet the PS resist any change, their excuse for this one is likely a bleeding heart variant of
    "Well not everyone has Internet access"
    cYp
    What an incredibly naive post.

    "I am obliged by statute" and then "Simple fact is that anyone who needs to can get web access". **shakes head**

    Simple fact is that not everybody who needs to can get web access, or can use a PC. Stats show that about 60% of houses have a PC, ie: 40% don't and not everyone works in an office with a web browser.

    The idea of my IT illiterate dad having to go to a web cafe to print off some form that he is 'obliged' to fill out is laughable. Cyp seems to think everyone operates in the little world he does.

    You just perfectly showed the difference between the private sector mindset and public sector obligation to 'all' the people. You fundamentally don't understand what a public service obligation is.

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