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Thread: A little bit of balance to the FF-bashing - the Carrickmines Re-zoning Fiasco

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    Default A little bit of balance to the FF-bashing - the Carrickmines Re-zoning Fiasco

    Don't think for a minute that re-zonings happened only in the early nineties.

    Rebels pass D18 shops rezone plan - National News, Frontpage - Herald.ie

    By Maeve Galvin

    Wednesday April 14 2010

    COUNCILLORS have defied the Environment Minister in moving to rezone a shopping centre development in Carrickmines.

    The move to extend the retail development at The Park, which is just off the M50, goes against the Dun Laoghaire Rathdown County Council's development plan, which was signed off on last Thursday.

    Following a debate at last night's council meeting, councillors passed the motion to vary the development plan and provide for a district centre by 15 votes to 13.

    This flies in the face of Environment Minister John Gormley's orders last month that directed the council not to rezone the Carrickmines land.

    Several councillors spoke out against the move. Labour councillor Richard Humphreys, a barrister, told the chamber that the move "wasn't a lawful motion".

    He said: "There is a legal obligation to comply with the minister's regulation.

    "In addition this would undermine the Cherrywood development and negatively impact on this council's interests. I feel that it would be ludicrous and making a mockery of this council for us to pass this."

    Fine Gael's Tom Joyce, Jim O'Leary, Barry Ward, John Bailey and Maria Bailey, and independent councillor Gearoid O'Keeffe put forward the motion, which aims to extend the retail land in Dublin 18 by 10,000sqm.

    It also proposes to reduce the retail land at the Cherrywood development by the same amount.

    Proposers of the motion said that they had been approached by developers who want to put in amenities such as a cinema, supermarket, leisure centre and restaurant, which would create 800 jobs.

    Councillor Jim O'Leary said that the move was in the interest of creating jobs for the county.

    Council management now plans to seek legal advice and report back to the council on the issue.

    hnews@herald.ie

    - Maeve Galvin
    And who is John Baily?

    [ame="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Bailey_%28Irish_politician%29"]John Bailey (Irish politician) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/ame]

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    Eh you've mixed up corruption with bad planning.

    I had a massive row oin here with an FG Councillor over this and he fcked off when he had more rezoning to do. I don;t know what this has to do with FF bashing and why you've posted a 5 month old article. The issue of Carrickmine retail park has been discussed. look it up and read my posts there
    We need to radically change every system that has enabled the wholesale destruction of the Irish landscape, rural and urban. There is no time for incremental step by step measures. The systems have failed utterly and the only hope for a real recovery requires the rule book to be torn up completely.

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    Quote Originally Posted by alonso View Post
    Eh you've mixed up corruption with bad planning.

    I had a massive row oin here with an FG Councillor over this and he fcked off when he had more rezoning to do. I don;t know what this has to do with FF bashing and why you've posted a 5 month old article. The issue of Carrickmine retail park has been discussed. look it up and read my posts there
    Thread is here http://www.politics.ie/environment/1...-issues-2.html

    Very interesting. I'd call it a mega-mall too. One thing not mentioned on that thread is that here is a Dunnes up the road at ballyogan already - it's a little shopping centre with a Dunnes, and a few small shops (I think a hairdressers and a pharmacy).

    Got the new luas out that way the other day. Once you are past the ballyogan road, residential development is minimal. There are the apartments that were sold recently at much reduced prices (think it was NAMA selling them) at Carrickmines.
    It'd be as easy for them to get the luas to ballyogan than walk the long walk up the road to the Park. Don't know what the councillor was on about in terms of residents needing amenities. There aren't many residents beside the Park and the ballyogan folk have a supermarket/shopping centre.

    Having a cinema in dun laoghaire, dundrum and stillorgan is closer to three cinemas than most people in the country live to one.

    Oh btw that councillor resigned which would explain his absence: http://www.politics.ie/fine-gael/128...resigning.html

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    Thanks Mar, had forgotten he had resigned. His arrogance from the outset of that prvious thread was remarkable - a real "come and get me" to Gormley

    anyway, I was in great form that day too http://www.politics.ie/environment/1...ml#post2553303
    We need to radically change every system that has enabled the wholesale destruction of the Irish landscape, rural and urban. There is no time for incremental step by step measures. The systems have failed utterly and the only hope for a real recovery requires the rule book to be torn up completely.

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    I wonder how many shopping complexes were given the go ahead because they included a cinema or leisure centre/bowling alley. For the good of the community reasoning etc. Then placed in the 3rd or 4th phase of the project, and obviously never built.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mar Tweedy View Post
    Thread is here http://www.politics.ie/environment/1...-issues-2.html

    Very interesting. I'd call it a mega-mall too. One thing not mentioned on that thread is that here is a Dunnes up the road at ballyogan already - it's a little shopping centre with a Dunnes, and a few small shops (I think a hairdressers and a pharmacy).

    Got the new luas out that way the other day. Once you are past the ballyogan road, residential development is minimal. There are the apartments that were sold recently at much reduced prices (think it was NAMA selling them) at Carrickmines.
    It'd be as easy for them to get the luas to ballyogan than walk the long walk up the road to the Park. Don't know what the councillor was on about in terms of residents needing amenities. There aren't many residents beside the Park and the ballyogan folk have a supermarket/shopping centre.

    Having a cinema in dun laoghaire, dundrum and stillorgan is closer to three cinemas than most people in the country live to one.

    Oh btw that councillor resigned which would explain his absence: http://www.politics.ie/fine-gael/128...resigning.html
    Don't know what the councillor was on about in terms of residents needing amenities. There aren't many residents beside the Park and the ballyogan folk have a supermarket/shopping centre.

    Why would a developer want to build a supermarket and amenities if there were no customers?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mar Tweedy View Post
    Thread is here http://www.politics.ie/environment/1...-issues-2.html

    Very interesting. I'd call it a mega-mall too. One thing not mentioned on that thread is that here is a Dunnes up the road at ballyogan already - it's a little shopping centre with a Dunnes, and a few small shops (I think a hairdressers and a pharmacy).

    Got the new luas out that way the other day. Once you are past the ballyogan road, residential development is minimal. There are the apartments that were sold recently at much reduced prices (think it was NAMA selling them) at Carrickmines.
    It'd be as easy for them to get the luas to ballyogan than walk the long walk up the road to the Park. Don't know what the councillor was on about in terms of residents needing amenities. There aren't many residents beside the Park and the ballyogan folk have a supermarket/shopping centre.

    Having a cinema in dun laoghaire, dundrum and stillorgan is closer to three cinemas than most people in the country live to one.

    Oh btw that councillor resigned which would explain his absence: http://www.politics.ie/fine-gael/128...resigning.html
    Don't know what the councillor was on about in terms of residents needing amenities. There aren't many residents beside the Park and the ballyogan folk have a supermarket/shopping centre.

    Why would a developer want to build a supermarket and amenities if there were no customers?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Odyessus View Post
    Why would a developer want to build a supermarket and amenities if there were no customers?
    Exactly. The supermarket and amenities are a red herring. The Park, Carrickmines is a warehouse type shop development. Like so many developments, the commercial parts are built first and the vaunted amenities will never arrive.

    None of this is a problem in itself - well, warehouse developments accessible only by car are a problem from a sustainability point of view and are usually full of chainstores (as Carrickmines is) thereby disadvantaging smaller, locally based shops - but even disregarding that, it is not part of DLR planning to have a town centre of that size at that site. It will not "create" any jobs because the only jobs it will "create" will be at the cost of the loss of other jobs in the town centres that have been planned for.

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    ONQ only a ff'er would think the ff bashing is party political, nicely argued on the alonso thread, sense didn't win out though
    Last edited by lostexpectation; 27th October 2010 at 07:20 PM.
    If I ask a question don't just 'like' the post, reply to it. - If I post a lot about a subject I may write a post about it at http://dublinstreams.blogspot.ie/

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    Quote Originally Posted by alonso View Post
    Eh you've mixed up corruption with bad planning.

    I had a massive row oin here with an FG Councillor over this and he fcked off when he had more rezoning to do. I don;t know what this has to do with FF bashing and why you've posted a 5 month old article. The issue of Carrickmine retail park has been discussed. look it up and read my posts there
    I note that high court just found against gormley. He was found to have acted ultra vires. Judge commented that those councillors who had voted for the rezoning had taken into account appropriate planning consideratons.

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