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Thread: German Foreign Ministry up to their neck in the Holocaust

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    Politics.ie Member Magror14's Avatar
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    Default German Foreign Ministry up to their neck in the Holocaust

    Seems that the view that the German foreign ministry was the "innocent" arm of the Nazi German government during the holocaust years has just taken a beating. The Irish Times has a article today on the publication of a report commissioned by Joschka Fischer.

    German diplomats 'complicit in Holocaust' - The Irish Times - Mon, Oct 25, 2010

    Without having read the report I still think there were huge numbers of diplomats (and indeed civil servants) in the German government who were not Nazis but simply had too much at stake to be in a position to do anything useful to resist.

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    They all knew exactly what was going on. Even before WW2, they were purging Jewish people out of their homes and whitewashing their businesses. Hitler was democratically elected by 32% of the population in 1932 even after writing Mein Kampf. Its not like he took them all by surprise as an unknown in a military coup or something.

    The German natives appeared happy enough under his command in the 30s and seemed to be in favour of his need for more space.
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    Politics.ie Member Magror14's Avatar
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    One of the first things that Hitler did was to abolish the the free press. He was then in a position to create a false reality for the German people who at that point in their history were particularly malleable. The vast majority of Germans knew that the Jews were being resettled and persecuted but I would say that only a small minority actually knew they were being exterminated.

    The Germans back then were about the same as we are today about the various genocidal programs going on around the world. We watch TV and click the button when a boring documentary about a foreign country comes on. Governments can do a lot of bad things when you have such an apathetic population as us.

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    Politics.ie Member Magror14's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cruimh View Post
    Thanks. Read that review. Pretty much my sentiments.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Magror14 View Post
    Seems that the view that the German foreign ministry was the "innocent" arm of the Nazi German government during the holocaust years has just taken a beating. The Irish Times has a article today on the publication of a report commissioned by Joschka Fischer.

    German diplomats 'complicit in Holocaust' - The Irish Times - Mon, Oct 25, 2010

    Without having read the report I still think there were huge numbers of diplomats (and indeed civil servants) in the German government who were not Nazis but simply had too much at stake to be in a position to do anything useful to resist.
    Many Nazis were utterly unrepentant after the war. I remember an interview on "The World at War" with the truly odious army officer Otto Remer [ame="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Otto_Ernst_Remer"]Otto Ernst Remer - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia@@AMEPARAM@@/wiki/File:Bundesarchiv_Bild_183-2004-0330-500,_Otto_Ernst_Remer.jpg" class="image"><img alt="Bundesarchiv Bild 183-2004-0330-500, Otto Ernst Remer.jpg" src="http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/c/c9/Bundesarchiv_Bild_183-2004-0330-500%2C_Otto_Ernst_Remer.jpg/200px-Bundesarchiv_Bild_183-2004-0330-500%2C_Otto_Ernst_Remer.jpg"@@AMEPARAM@@commons/thumb/c/c9/Bundesarchiv_Bild_183-2004-0330-500%2C_Otto_Ernst_Remer.jpg/200px-Bundesarchiv_Bild_183-2004-0330-500%2C_Otto_Ernst_Remer.jpg[/ame] who left no doubt about his admiration for Hitler and that given the chance he would have done the same thing all over again.

    As for the Foreign Office, the Foreign Minister (Ribbentrop) was hanged at Nuremburg. There's no doubt many of the Foreign Office officials were a full part of Nazi war policy. As for widespread complicity in the Holocaust, I have to admit it's news to me. But clearly it wasn't to Joshka Fischer and many others in Germany who had knowledge or experience to the contrary.
    Last edited by McDave; 25th October 2010 at 08:00 PM.

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    Politics.ie Member Cruimh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Magror14 View Post
    Thanks. Read that review. Pretty much my sentiments.
    Probably one of the most disturbing books I've read.

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    Politics.ie Member soubresauts's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by McDave View Post
    Many Nazis were utterly unrepentant after the war...
    It is disturbing to see how many ex-Nazis assumed powerful positions after the war (some of them after having served sentences for war crimes). What's more, they were at the root of the EU in the 1950s and have held a large measure of control of the expanding community ever since. Details here.

    About The Kindly Ones by Littell,
    Quote Originally Posted by Cruimh View Post
    Probably one of the most disturbing books I've read.
    From reading the review I get the impression that the novel matches fairly closely the non-fiction Hitler's Willing Executioners by Goldhagen, certainly one of the most disturbing books I've read. The latter book is bolstered by many photographs...
    15 Jan 2001 -- Fine Gael pledged to end fluoridation because of "serious health concerns".

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    Politics.ie Member Magror14's Avatar
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    A propos of nothing as they say..My father stayed at the Irish College in Rome in 1946. He said there a bunch of Germans staying there whom he said were former SS men on the run. Dunno whether to believe him.

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    Politics.ie Member ne0ica's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Magror14 View Post
    Seems that the view that the German foreign ministry was the "innocent" arm of the Nazi German government during the holocaust years has just taken a beating. The Irish Times has a article today on the publication of a report commissioned by Joschka Fischer.

    German diplomats 'complicit in Holocaust' - The Irish Times - Mon, Oct 25, 2010

    Without having read the report I still think there were huge numbers of diplomats (and indeed civil servants) in the German government who were not Nazis but simply had too much at stake to be in a position to do anything useful to resist.
    Nothing really new here. Most historians were aware of this already. Ribbentrop was hanged for his simplicity in war crimes.

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