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Thread: Party Politics in NI

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    Politics.ie Member Cruimh's Avatar
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    Default Party Politics in NI

    Robinson-McGuinness plan to tackle sectarianism criticised

    For me this illustrates why we struggle to make headway here - kneejerk condemnations from the parties other than SF and the DUP. The sooner the SDLP and the UUP are extinct the better.

    This problem is hundreds of years old - and yet there is supposed to be a magic cure which Robinson and McGuinness should have identified.

    So - offer something to start the ball rolling - and get shot down by the rest of the pack who are agin it because it comes from their rivals. Try and discuss anything significant and the sectarian card is played.

    Something has been offered. The next step is for people to make suggestions as to how it could and should be improved and implemented.
    But there is an election coming - so no chance.

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    Whats wrong with anyone taking the roll of opposition to any Gov.

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    Politics.ie Member Cruimh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Follyborn View Post
    Whats wrong with anyone taking the roll of opposition to any Gov.
    Opposition should be constructive.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cruimh View Post
    Opposition should be constructive.
    Exactly what the opposition always say about the Gov. LOL

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cruimh View Post
    Opposition should be constructive.
    Opposition should be an alternative
    There is always hope when people are forced to listen to both sides.

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    I have to say that I very much agree with your sentiments and share your frustration. In an ideal world, opposition should be both principled and constructive but far too often in Northern Ireland all political parties, but particularly the SDLP and the UUP in recent years have resorted to knee-jerk criticisms and have failed to engage objectively with other political parties, namely the DUP and Sinn Fein. The recent outbreak of near hysteric’s, finger-pointing and accusations of ‘sectarianism’ in reaction to Peter Robinson’s education statement is a prime example of the immaturity, and refusal of certain political parties to participate in a mature and open debate without the need to bang the sectarian drum as a means of opposition.

    By all accounts Peter Robinson’s speech should have precipitated a mature and sensible debate concerning education in Northern Ireland and yet inspite of the near groundbreaking nature the First Minister’s speech, the valid and very real concerns expressed in his statement were simply swept aside and belittled as nothing more than sectarian ‘rabble rousing’ of which it was most certainly not. In relation to the plans offered by both the DUP and Sinn Fein in regards to ending sectarianism, I feel that those proposals should have been objectively hailed insomuch that both parties are working towards consensus and if criticism was to be made then such criticism should have taken place within the context of other political parties at the very least acknowledging the efforts which have already been made by Robinson and McGuinness, and which are due to be enlarged and enriched by public opinion etc.

    It is a very unfortunate situation but obviously not unique to Northern Ireland but I do find criticism for criticism sake rather tiresome, particularly when one observes the daily proceedings of the Northern Ireland assembly. Bizarrely, the two political parties which had previously been viewed by many as the most extreme in Northern Ireland, the DUP and Sinn Fein are now acting entirely responsibly and the moderates, the architects of the Good Friday Agreement, the SDLP and the UUP are more often than not guilty of engaging in cheap party politics and being deliberately obstructive beyond reason. For example, I have friends who previously voted the SDLP in the past and yet they are deeply resentful of Margaret Ritchie and feel that she is an extremely poor leader. Her knee-jerk criticisms and over the top response to Robinson’s education statement (including the apparent beating of the Catholic drum) has left some of my friends scratching their heads in sheer dismay, and although they would never vote Sinn Fein they are hugely disappointed in the direction the SDLP is making particularly under Ritchie’s stewardship because they feel that she is deliberately obstructive and makes criticism for criticism sake.

    I think that it is all very interesting and of course no political party is immune, particularly in Northern Ireland of engaging in tribalism but I have to say that I have been very – surprisingly – impressed by the responsible work of the DUP and Sinn Fein, especially since Hillsborough, and very disheartened by the SDLP and the UUP, both of which would appear – as Peter Robinson once jokingly suggested ‘got ruptured’ in the process of doing the heavy lifting of the peace process. In many respects the sooner the SDLP and the UUP stop bemoaning their dwindling political fortunes and whingeing about their ‘heavy lifting’ (of which they can rightly be proud) the more forward looking both parties may become within the assembly.

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    In the interests of balance the Unionist should go into a voluntary opposition position for , lets say 25 years.

    It would be a good way of trying to reconcile their misuse of power from partition to the late sixties.

    Constructive opposition would be good learning experience for them and would be a good education for them about sharing power when they did get back to participate in goverment.

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    Politics.ie Member Cruimh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by blinding View Post
    In the interests of balance the Unionist should go into a voluntary opposition position for , lets say 25 years.

    It would be a good way of trying to reconcile their misuse of power from partition to the late sixties.

    Constructive opposition would be good learning experience for them and would be a good education for them about sharing power when they did get back to participate in goverment.
    a sensible contribution ..... not.

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    on the unionist side the problem is that the UUP has no reason to exist as it and the DUP are very similar, could anyone tell me what policies they deffer on? Both are central right, unionists leaning left can support the Alliance party.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cruimh View Post
    Robinson-McGuinness plan to tackle sectarianism criticised

    For me this illustrates why we struggle to make headway here - kneejerk condemnations from the parties other than SF and the DUP. The sooner the SDLP and the UUP are extinct the better.

    This problem is hundreds of years old - and yet there is supposed to be a magic cure which Robinson and McGuinness should have identified.

    So - offer something to start the ball rolling - and get shot down by the rest of the pack who are agin it because it comes from their rivals. Try and discuss anything significant and the sectarian card is played.

    Something has been offered. The next step is for people to make suggestions as to how it could and should be improved and implemented.
    But there is an election coming - so no chance.
    To be fair this was really bad. The strategy was never going to tackle everything but it should have done more than raised the issue.

    Quote Originally Posted by DerryBee View Post
    I have to say that I very much agree with your sentiments and share your frustration. In an ideal world, opposition should be both principled and constructive but far too often in Northern Ireland all political parties, but particularly the SDLP and the UUP in recent years have resorted to knee-jerk criticisms and have failed to engage objectively with other political parties, namely the DUP and Sinn Fein. The recent outbreak of near hysteric’s, finger-pointing and accusations of ‘sectarianism’ in reaction to Peter Robinson’s education statement is a prime example of the immaturity, and refusal of certain political parties to participate in a mature and open debate without the need to bang the sectarian drum as a means of opposition.

    By all accounts Peter Robinson’s speech should have precipitated a mature and sensible debate concerning education in Northern Ireland and yet inspite of the near groundbreaking nature the First Minister’s speech, the valid and very real concerns expressed in his statement were simply swept aside and belittled as nothing more than sectarian ‘rabble rousing’ of which it was most certainly not. In relation to the plans offered by both the DUP and Sinn Fein in regards to ending sectarianism, I feel that those proposals should have been objectively hailed insomuch that both parties are working towards consensus and if criticism was to be made then such criticism should have taken place within the context of other political parties at the very least acknowledging the efforts which have already been made by Robinson and McGuinness, and which are due to be enlarged and enriched by public opinion etc.

    It is a very unfortunate situation but obviously not unique to Northern Ireland but I do find criticism for criticism sake rather tiresome, particularly when one observes the daily proceedings of the Northern Ireland assembly. Bizarrely, the two political parties which had previously been viewed by many as the most extreme in Northern Ireland, the DUP and Sinn Fein are now acting entirely responsibly and the moderates, the architects of the Good Friday Agreement, the SDLP and the UUP are more often than not guilty of engaging in cheap party politics and being deliberately obstructive beyond reason. For example, I have friends who previously voted the SDLP in the past and yet they are deeply resentful of Margaret Ritchie and feel that she is an extremely poor leader. Her knee-jerk criticisms and over the top response to Robinson’s education statement (including the apparent beating of the Catholic drum) has left some of my friends scratching their heads in sheer dismay, and although they would never vote Sinn Fein they are hugely disappointed in the direction the SDLP is making particularly under Ritchie’s stewardship because they feel that she is deliberately obstructive and makes criticism for criticism sake.

    I think that it is all very interesting and of course no political party is immune, particularly in Northern Ireland of engaging in tribalism but I have to say that I have been very – surprisingly – impressed by the responsible work of the DUP and Sinn Fein, especially since Hillsborough, and very disheartened by the SDLP and the UUP, both of which would appear – as Peter Robinson once jokingly suggested ‘got ruptured’ in the process of doing the heavy lifting of the peace process. In many respects the sooner the SDLP and the UUP stop bemoaning their dwindling political fortunes and whingeing about their ‘heavy lifting’ (of which they can rightly be proud) the more forward looking both parties may become within the assembly.
    the greatest attacks on Robinson's statement that I heard were from Sinn Fein and in particular John O'Dowd who seemed to be on every radio programme about it.

    Ritichie said the following:

    "This is typical Peter Robinson," said Ms Ritchie.

    "On the one hand he says the most visionary thing ever said by a DUP politician about our divided society, and then he spoils it with an old-fashioned political sideswipe at Catholic schools.

    "He is still right that we should aim for a future where our children are increasingly educated together - but blaming Catholics for the division is shameful and totally the wrong place to start."

    Anybody who read Robinson's statement would have seen it as a thinly veiled attack on the catholic sector. The thrust of it was that catholic schools should no longer be state-funded. In view of that, Ritichie'scomments were amongst the most balanced.

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