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Thread: Why the Dail must Vote Against the guarantee tonightht

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    Politics.ie Member cozzy121's Avatar
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    Default Why the Dail must Vote Against the guarantee tonightht

    It's time for TD's to finally redeem themselves in the eyes of the people the claim to represent.
    It’s time for them to break from corrupt bertie and his property bubble and start anew.

    David McWilliams: We must face reality - and end bank guarantee - David McWilliams, Columnists - Independent.ie

    However, the key is to define reality. Welch explained to me that if you don't define the crisis, others will define it for you and then you play catch up and are on a hiding to nothing.
    Reality is not being defined. The reality is that the Irish Government's credibility is being contaminated by the banks. Today the guarantee should -- according to the original plan -- have lapsed and the banks should be left to deal with their own mess. The reason the guarantee was granted two years ago was to avoid a run on the banks in the chaos of autumn 2008. Then, once that was prevented, the Government could have seen which banks it was going to save and which it was going to let go. Clearly this would have involved using the clock ticking down to the end of the guarantee as an incentive for the creditors to come to the table and do a deal with the State. But instead of using the guarantee as a bargaining chip, it was used as a blanket bailout.
    "WAKE UP! THE RICH ARE RAPING YOU!"

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    Politics.ie Member Disillusioned democrat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cozzy121 View Post
    It's time for TD's to finally redeem themselves in the eyes of the people the claim to represent.
    It’s time for them to break from corrupt bertie and his property bubble and start anew.

    David McWilliams: We must face reality - and end bank guarantee - David McWilliams, Columnists - Independent.ie
    Primetime last night pretty much called the bankers liars and the government stupid for believing them, yet two years later the arrogance and power-lust of the FF/GP still prevents them from admitting they were wrong.

    Returning after 12 weeks hols to vote on the most crucial decision this Dial may ever make demonstrates how seriously FF treat democracy.

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    Politics.ie Member sport02's Avatar
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    Fianna Fail and the Green's need to grow a pair,instead of balls the size of malteseers, and contempt for the people of Ireland.
    They are deluded and arrogant, leading us into the abyss.

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    Politics.ie Member roc_'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Disillusioned democrat View Post
    Primetime last night pretty much called the bankers liars and the government stupid for believing them, yet two years later the arrogance and power-lust of the FF/GP still prevents them from admitting they were wrong.

    Returning after 12 weeks hols to vote on the most crucial decision this Dial may ever make demonstrates how seriously FF treat democracy.
    Primetime are being disingenuous.

    If they are trying to make out that it was the government's 'stupidity', and the bankers' 'lies' that caused the actions that were taken, to be taken, then they are being disingenuous.

    No - back then, the powers that be (RTE and Independent newspapers and Bloxhams included) knew what was in front of them, and many people said it out loud and clear (example, see Morgan Kelly below), but there was a systemic, institutional collusion (tacit) at national level, and refusal to acknowledge the facts and figures that were well in the public domain. - All in the name of hoping to keep the party going, and allow the 'players' to get out with their gains intact.

    Just look at the primetime that was on back then - I think it is obvious what was going on.

    [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=11CCxv2ueiQ]YouTube - Morgan Kelly PrimeTime 20080930[/ame]
    Last edited by roc_; 29th September 2010 at 04:29 PM.
    “Words are animals, alive with a will of their own”.

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    Michael Noonan on RTE radio at lunchtime seemed to be suggesting that FG would support the guarantee again.

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    Politics.ie Member Simbo67's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by roc_ View Post
    Primetime are being disingenuous.

    If they are trying to make out that it was the government's 'stupidity', and the bankers' 'lies' that caused the actions that were taken, to be taken, then they are being disingenuous.

    No - back then, the powers that be (RTE and Independent newspapers and Bloxhams included) knew what was in front of them, and many people said it out loud and clear (example, see Morgan Kelly below), but there was a systemic, institutional collusion (tacit) at national level, and refusal to acknowledge the facts and figures that were well in the public domain. - All in the name of hoping to keep the party going, and allow the 'players' to get out with their gains intact.

    Just look at the primetime that was on back then - I think it is obvious what was going on.

    YouTube - Morgan Kelly PrimeTime 20080930
    Brendan Keenan saying that the bad loans would amount to 1% of the banks balance sheet. Bless.

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    Politics.ie Member Simbo67's Avatar
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    God Morgan Kelly called it completely right (but on the conservative side).

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    Quote Originally Posted by Baron von Biffo View Post
    Michael Noonan on RTE radio at lunchtime seemed to be suggesting that FG would support the guarantee again.
    At minimum, they should demand full disclosure before supporting the extension.

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    Politics.ie Member eoghanacht's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Baron von Biffo View Post
    Michael Noonan on RTE radio at lunchtime seemed to be suggesting that FG would support the guarantee again.
    Thats why they are no better than those on the opposite side of the house
    Britain operated death squads - ''97% of the Loyalists I interviewed were working directly for the State.'' - Nuala O'Loan. #FreeAhedTamimi

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    Quote Originally Posted by ivnryn View Post
    At minimum, they should demand full disclosure before supporting the extension.
    At a minimum they should tell Lenihan to go and sh1te.

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