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Thread: Croke Park Deal about to be junked?

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    Politics.ie Member adamirer's Avatar
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    Default Croke Park Deal about to be junked?

    The closing dates for implementation details on the CPD is Wednesday. Submission are to be made from the satellite depts/organisations back to the centre (DoF & Taoiseach).

    As I understand it, Gov didnt approach the unions with any firm plans for what they wanted. So not much was agreed centrally. Instead, the Gov did a trawl of the depts and satellites to look for ideas. The deadline is tomorrow, but rumour is not much is forthcoming from the wings. The depts (etc) are basically waiting for central guidence so as not to be seen as over egging the situation.

    Is this death by osmosis? Is the lack of leadership the Gov is showing in this area a sign that they feel they've killed off any lingering union resentment over the last 2 years a) tax rises & levys b) pension levy c) pays cuts and are getting ready to drop the deal due to clause 28 "unforeseen circumstances" - when in reality, everyone foresaw the mess they were making of things.
    Last edited by adamirer; 28th September 2010 at 02:07 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by adamirer View Post
    The closing dates for implementation details on the CPD is Wednesday. Submission are to be made from the satellite depts/organisations back to the centre (DoF & Taoiseach).

    As I understand it, Gov didnt apprahc the unions with any firm plans for what they wanted. So not much was agreed centrally. Instead, the Gov did a trawl of the depts and satellites to look for ideas. The deadline is tomorrow, but rumour is not much is forthcoming from the wings.

    Is this death by osmosis? Is the lack of leadership the Gov is showing in this area a sign that they feel they've killed off any lingering union resentment over the last 2 years a) tax rises & levys b) pension levy c) pays cuts and are getting ready to drop the deal due to clause 28 "unforeseen circumstances" - when in reality, everyone foresaw the mess they were making of things.
    You could easily be right, there seems a real lack of engagement from the Govt side with Unions who are ready and wanting for the deal to go through. I laugh on here the way that folks think that Civil Service Unions have power - we have none!!! We are the ones pushing for the implementation of this deal, the Govt are the ones dragging their heels.

    I still don't think the Govt will back out... I really don't... as I feel that the they will make unbelievable savings from being able to move surplus public sector staff from one Department/Local Authority/Agency to another.

    If this deal falls then I doubt the Government will last too long.

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    Politics.ie Member Skyrocket's Avatar
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    Maybe Eamon Gilmore might have something to say about this (or maybe not!).

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    It doesn't matter where any of us fall in relation to this argument the deal is dead. To keep their part of the deal the Irish state needs funds which it is now clear will no longer come from international markets.

    While i totally disagreed with the deal in the first place i take no joy or otherwise from its imminent collapse.

    Fellow Irish people including many members of my extended family will be greatly affected.

    Bertie and the unions take a bow.

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    Politics.ie Member bormotello's Avatar
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    Unions and budget cuts 'are stifling public sector' - National News, Frontpage - Independent.ie
    THE improvement of state services is blocked by age-old hierarchies, hardline unions and the Government's stranglehold on budgets and staffing, according to public service managers.

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    I think FF created the whole deal to give themselves time. They had no intention of implementing the deal and hence the problems quoted above.

    The time was designed to wait for an economic improvement (FF hoped and prayed) or stage a government collapse.
    We have turned the corner.I commend this Budget to the House. Brian Lenihan, 9 December 2009

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    Politics.ie Member Kevin Doyle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by grafter1 View Post
    It doesn't matter where any of us fall in relation to this argument the deal is dead. To keep their part of the deal the Irish state needs funds which it is now clear will no longer come from international markets.

    While i totally disagreed with the deal in the first place i take no joy or otherwise from its imminent collapse.

    Fellow Irish people including many members of my extended family will be greatly affected.

    Bertie and the unions take a bow.
    add to that the double whammy of increased taxation and kissing or CT rate goodbye.
    Voters don't decide issues, they decide who will decide issues.

    George Will

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    Why do people in leadership in the country expect the things there are managing to spontaneously reorder themselves? Unless the direct something it will not happen. They are either grossly unless at their job or intend the reform to fail. Either is a disgrace.

    I am delighted I voted against this deal, when is fails I never want to hear another word about partnership or deals. Run the country and keep the rest of us out of your incompetence.

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    Quote Originally Posted by adamirer View Post
    The closing dates for implementation details on the CPD is Wednesday. Submission are to be made from the satellite depts/organisations back to the centre (DoF & Taoiseach).

    As I understand it, Gov didnt approach the unions with any firm plans for what they wanted. So not much was agreed centrally. Instead, the Gov did a trawl of the depts and satellites to look for ideas. The deadline is tomorrow, but rumour is not much is forthcoming from the wings. The depts (etc) are basically waiting for central guidence so as not to be seen as over egging the situation.

    Is this death by osmosis? Is the lack of leadership the Gov is showing in this area a sign that they feel they've killed off any lingering union resentment over the last 2 years a) tax rises & levys b) pension levy c) pays cuts and are getting ready to drop the deal due to clause 28 "unforeseen circumstances" - when in reality, everyone foresaw the mess they were making of things.
    Not what I am hearing.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin Doyle View Post
    add to that the double whammy of increased taxation and kissing or CT rate goodbye.
    Correct. Our CT rate can take a hike as far as i'm concerned. I dont care if it costs some jobs its not fair to ask Mr Irishman to pay 60c on his last euro earned while asking Mr. Foreign Corporation to pay 12.5c.

    The low corporate tax rate was a master stroke in the 1990s when we where basically a glorified third world country. We successfully attracted FDI but inevitably you become uncompetitive.

    To sustain our prosperity we needed to move to a reliance on home grown entrepreneurs and businesses.

    People talk about leadership and the one word that i look for in a 'leader' is vision.

    We have no vision in this country.

    I told a politician in 2002 that we should raise Corp Tax to 20% and use the additional revenue to promote home grown businesses and entrepreneurs. I tried to explain to him that you can't rely on FDI forever and no country has managed to sustain prosperity relying on it.

    Anyway we are where we are where we are where we are

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