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Thread: North/South Catholic divide

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    Default North/South Catholic divide

    The conventional arguments made in the Republic against a United Ireland are the inconvenience of integrating one million Protestants into Irish national institutions and the cost of maintaining British levels of subsidies to the Northern economy. But, it could also be argued, that 90 years of separation have created equally profound differences between Catholics North and South of the border, similar to the Ossi-Wessi gulf that persists in Germany. On the national question, Northerners have accused "Free Staters" of being "soft" since independence, being accused in turn of being obdurate hardliners. The drift in the Republic towards secular liberalism hasn't been matched in the Six Counties, where a greater degree of Catholic conservatism pervades both nationalist parties. These trends are particularly apparent in Ulster GAA, with clubs named after and commemorating hunger strikers, which the national organisation rightly steers well clear of, and also in opposition to rule changes. There are probably others that are more apparent, but unification would take decades to erase this gulf.
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    Politics.ie Member picador's Avatar
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    You appear to be conflating Catholocism with nationalism. How does this 'Catholic conservatism' manifest itself - lower divorce figures, opposition to contraception?
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    I know I am going to regret getting involved in a thread here but.

    I have never heard integrating 1 million protestants expressed as an issue with reunification.

    Subsidies and support costs yes but that no.

    How does naming GAA clubs after hunger strikers have anything to do with catholicism ? Either North or South ?

    Your thread referees to a divide amongst catholics but your post contains nothing to so with catholicism ?

    I'm confused.

  4. #4

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    Weird post,I'd agree with Picador.Most northern Catholics I meet are instinctively more leftwing than us.It manifest itself in little ways;they can't believe we still have to pay for school textbooks,for example.They take a comprehensive health service,free at the point of delivery,completely for granted.Of course,this itself may be a hidden barrier to unification,but I failto see where the conservative catholic ethos comes into play.

    Btw,floating,isn't your local GAA club named for Austin Stack - who organised strikes and riots in Crumlin Rd prison before fighting against the treaty?

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    Politics.ie Member Cruimh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FloatingVoterTralee View Post
    The conventional arguments made in the Republic against a United Ireland are the inconvenience of integrating one million Protestants into Irish national institutions and the cost of maintaining British levels of subsidies to the Northern economy. But, it could also be argued, that 90 years of separation have created equally profound differences between Catholics North and South of the border, similar to the Ossi-Wessi gulf that persists in Germany. On the national question, Northerners have accused "Free Staters" of being "soft" since independence, being accused in turn of being obdurate hardliners. The drift in the Republic towards secular liberalism hasn't been matched in the Six Counties, where a greater degree of Catholic conservatism pervades both nationalist parties. These trends are particularly apparent in Ulster GAA, with clubs named after and commemorating hunger strikers, which the national organisation rightly steers well clear of, and also in opposition to rule changes. There are probably others that are more apparent, but unification would take decades to erase this gulf.
    John McGahern made a point in an interview published in Studies Magazine in 2001 that Catholicism in the North seemed to lag behind Catholicism on his side of the border.

    I live beside the border and I have a cousin who was a diocesan examiner and he tells me that to examine religious doctrine in the schools when you go 6-7 miles across the border, Catholicism is 40-50 years back in the North of Ireland. He was talking about 15 years ago.

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    You only have to look at the threads in here and in the rest of the board to see the difference, most of our northern nationalist posters in this section seem hopelessly blinkered and out of touch in comparison, barely bothering to enter debate on issues with what they see as their fellow countrymen on anything that doesn't involve the British or Irish nationalism/republicanism. Northern Ireland is a place apart.

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    Is that why Criumh was just discussing an issue about the ROI president?

    Dont know how I seen that as it wasnt in the NI section.
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    Quote Originally Posted by st333ve View Post
    Is that why Criumh was just discussing an issue about the ROI president?

    Dont know how I seen that as it wasnt in the NI section.
    Criumh posts in there more than most of the rest of you nordie nationalists. petunia

    You are a great example of what I am saying st333ve, 95% of your posts are weird obsessional diatribes about the OO, while your average ROI person is on here posting about the economy etc.

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    Politics.ie Member Cruimh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Portstewart View Post
    Criumh posts in there more than most of the rest of you nordie nationalists. petunia

    You are a great example of what I am saying st333ve, 95% of your posts are weird obsessional diatribes about the OO, while your average ROI person is on here posting about the economy etc.
    I don't know any nordie nationalists - or southern ones either - that talk about j-walking

    He's a yank!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cruimh View Post
    I don't know any nordie nationalists - or southern ones either - that talk about j-walking

    He's a yank!
    Probably, he's an extremist at any rate compared to the vast majority of ROI people, so is pic, I don't think they've noticed.

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