Follow @PoliticsIE
 
 
 
Page 1 of 9 12345 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 84

Thread: Barbarism or Justice ?

  1. #1
    Politics.ie Member Cruimh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    County Londonderry
    Posts
    35,435
    Mentioned
    2 Post(s)

    Default Barbarism or Justice ?

    Utah firing squad executes US killer Ronnie Lee Gardner

    How and why Gardner was shot

    Doesn't seem any doubt about the man's guilt.

    So some issues

    1) the Death penalty - yes or no ? Not in favour myself.

    2) Firing Squad - an acceptable method ? I'd sooner have this than gas, injection, electric chair or hanging.

    3) Length of time between sentence and execution. Is it not barbaric to have this man end up in effect both serving a life sentence and then be executed ?

    4) The state got the worst of both worlds - 25 years of looking after him plus all the expense of dealing with all the legal appeals.

  2. #2
    Politics.ie Member The Caped Cod's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Posts
    3,595
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)

    Default

    1)Personaly I'm againstthe death penalty.
    2) If I were the prisoner then I would prefer firing squad to any of the other methods. Gardner is rumoured to have said he chose this method because "If I gotta die, then someone's gonna have to clean up the mess".
    3) Perhaps it could be argued that a long wait imposes a double sentence but there are two points to consider. One the time to mount an appeal, for the reversal of the verdict or for clemancy, the other is that if the person is guilty then perhaps the wait is a justified punishment, to thin kabout their crimes with the prospect of their own death in front of them.
    4)25 years on death row is an exaggeration. He also had to be kept in isolation as he was extremely violent. I can't see who benefited from it, not even Gardner
    "Authority that cannot be questioned is tyranny and I will not accept tyranny, any tyranny, even that of heaven."
    - Terry Pratchett

  3. #3
    Politics.ie Member Interista's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Posts
    4,128
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)

    Default

    1) the Death penalty - yes or no ? Not in favour myself.

    2) Firing Squad - an acceptable method ? I'd sooner have this than gas, injection, electric chair or hanging.

    3) Length of time between sentence and execution. Is it not barbaric to have this man end up in effect both serving a life sentence and then be executed ?

    4) The state got the worst of both worlds - 25 years of looking after him plus all the expense of dealing with all the legal appeals.
    Agree with pretty much everything you say. The length of time and the amount of money spent on multiple appeals makes a mockery of the idea that the death sentence is cheaper than lifelong incarceration.

  4. #4
    Politics.ie Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Posts
    12,595
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)

    Default

    I'm against the death penalty, no matter how barbaric the crime.

  5. #5
    Politics.ie Member roc_'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Posts
    5,826
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)

    Default

    Of course this was absolutely barbaric.

    For sure, justice was served in some kind of way. But what next for these middle American hicks? Public stonings?
    “Words are animals, alive with a will of their own”.

  6. #6
    Politics.ie Member Destiny's Soldier's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Milan & Cork
    Posts
    2,334
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)

    Default

    And people say the US is a civilised country. Of course it is. Only to a point. This sick, and twisted mindset of a State which treats human life with such disrespect is abhorrent.

    Although one's natural instinct would be to kill the person who perpetrated such a crime, it is self destroying to bring yourself to that level.

    Although, killing by firing squad is actually an honest way of killing someone. Because death is death whether it be by lethal injection or beheading. It is always ugly.

    The US is very much like Saudi Arabia in many ways.
    Cowardice asks the question - is it safe? Expediency asks the question - is it politic?
    Vanity asks the question - is it popular? But Conscience asks the question - is it right?
    And there comes a time when one must take a position that is neither safe, nor politic, nor popular;but one must take it simply because it is right. -MLK

  7. #7
    Politics.ie Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Posts
    640
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)

    Default

    This guy chose the firing squad, only available in Utah and not since a number of years ago. Given he has been incarcerated so long, he was in jail and chose this execution method before the stop was put on it.

  8. #8
    Politics.ie Member Interista's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Posts
    4,128
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)

    Default

    The US is very much like Saudi Arabia in many ways.
    Well, that's a huge exaggeration but I see your point. Portadown might be a bit more like it!

    What I do think is that America is very different from just about every other Western nation, including Canada. Its use of the death penalty, uniquely (if I'm not mistaken) among Western nations, is just one illustration of this.

  9. #9
    Politics.ie Member Sync's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Posts
    27,584
    Mentioned
    2 Post(s)

    Default

    1) the Death penalty - yes or no ? Not in favour myself.
    In favour in theory, against it in practice. There isn't a country on earth that applies it fairly. The disproportionate number of minorities who get executed, the relentless procession of faulty/manufactured evidence etc etc. If we lived in a world where you were absolutely promised a fair trial, and all the judgements were 100% accurate, I'd have no issue with courts giving out the death penalty. We don't so I do.

    2) Firing Squad - an acceptable method ? I'd sooner have this than gas, injection, electric chair or hanging.
    God yes. By far the most humane way of doing it. It's certainly what I'd request.

    3) Length of time between sentence and execution. Is it not barbaric to have this man end up in effect both serving a life sentence and then be executed ?
    Nah. You've got to give him multiple tries at getting off in court. That takes time. I'd rather it took a long time and he was fully represented than he gets executed 2 days after the first trial.

    4) The state got the worst of both worlds - 25 years of looking after him plus all the expense of dealing with all the legal appeals.
    So kill him early and charge the family for the bullets?
    I'm living in America, and in America, you're on your own. America's not a country. It's just a business. Now f***ing pay me.

  10. #10
    Politics.ie Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    Poblacht na hÉireann
    Posts
    448
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Destiny's Soldier View Post
    The US is very much like Saudi Arabia in many ways.
    In fairness to Saudi Arabia, at least they have the honesty to do it in public instead of hiding it behind locked doors.
    "I hereby declare that the Continuity Executive and the Continuity Army Council are the lawful Executive and Army Council respectively of the Irish Republican Army, and that the governmental authority, delegated in the Proclamation of 1938, now resides in the Continuity Army Council, and its lawful successors."

    Comdt. General Thomas Maguire

Page 1 of 9 12345 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •