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Thread: Israeli Navy attatck US Ship - Murders 34 US sailors

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    Default Israeli Navy attatck US Ship - Murders 34 US sailors

    Not a lot of people know this, but posted in light of the flotilla attack.

    In 1967, the USS liberty was under sustained attack off the coast of Egypt, but well inside international waters.

    Not a lot of Americans know this.

    http://http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dj9VjNRpn4g

    ok, so a typo in the header, let's see who tries to kick the info because of it.....
    Last edited by Polytics.Irie; 1st June 2010 at 09:38 AM. Reason: typo admitted
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    Politics.ie Member Sync's Avatar
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    Can't see Youtube, but if it's the Liberty attack most Americans know about it. It was a huge news story back in the day, and every few years a survivor or researcher comes out with new evidence or opinion on the motivations behind the attack. What you meant to say was you didn't know about it until yesterday. If you did you wouldn't be throwing around the word murder over an unproven incident, or basing everything you know on Youtube.

    The US concluded it was an accident, but since then you've had respected people come out and say that the report into the affair was a cover up by McNamara at the time. One of those things that's impossible to prove, but it's a very reasonable hypothisis to suggest that Israel did it to try and blame the Soviets in an effort to drag America into the war on their side

    The NSA report is here http://www.nsa.gov/public_info/_file...ack_sigint.pdf
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    lots of people know that, and know the various theories and conspiracy theories associated with it also, but hey lets just dig it up yet again as just another way to criticize Israel some more

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    The Liberty was hit by mistake.
    The Israeli Air Force mistook it for an enemy ship.

    These kind of incidents happen all the time in war when bombs or artillery land on a friendly position instead of the enemy because someone reads out the wrong map co-ordinates or a soldier who left his foxhole at night to take a crap in the bushes is accidentally shot dead by his own men on his return when he forgets the password when they issue a challenge in the dark.

    There is no evidence whatsoever the Liberty incident was in any way deliberate.

    Years later a Soviet air force fighter interceptor shot down a Korean 747 civilian airliner after the crew mistakenly flew into Soviet airspace and it was mistaken for an American spy plane due to heightened Cold War tension.

    Tragic but accidental.

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    Politics.ie Member Sync's Avatar
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    No evidence aside from the testimony of sailors that Israelis flew over the ship frequently and could see the flag, the testimony of sailors who heard Israeli radio chatter IDing the US ship and the affadavits and statements from a former Captain, a former Admiral and a former Joint Chiefs of Staff chairman, all of whom have said that there was an active coverup by McNamara.

    Apart from that, no evidence.
    I'm living in America, and in America, you're on your own. America's not a country. It's just a business. Now f***ing pay me.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sync View Post
    No evidence aside from the testimony of sailors that Israelis flew over the ship frequently and could see the flag, the testimony of sailors who heard Israeli radio chatter IDing the US ship and the affadavits and statements from a former Captain, a former Admiral and a former Joint Chiefs of Staff chairman, all of whom have said that there was an active coverup by McNamara.

    Apart from that, no evidence.
    Actually you're right no evidence.

    Q1. How can some sailors testify to what somebody else could see?
    P1. The sailors can only provide one outlook on an event which involved many different people, services and factors. I'm sure some of the sailors thought that the Israeli's knowingly and deliberately attacked a US Flagged ship - however it does not stand up to the evidence outside of their testimony.

    Q2. No sailors overheard Israeli Radio chatter - this requires a source.
    P1. It was claimed that Israel 'Jammed' radio waves. They didn't in fact. Recently declassified NSA communication intercepts support the misidentification argument.

    Q3. A Former captain, Admiral (of which I'm dubious if its the one oft claimed) and Chairman of the JCS is simply an appeal to authority with no actual supporting argument.

    The USS Liberty was a tragic incident the result of a series of minor and major errors (mostly due to incompetence) and the fog of war.

    But the three most important questions can only be answered reasonably one way.

    Why attack the USS Liberty in the first place?
    Why attack the USS Liberty with weapons unsuited to sinking the USS Liberty.
    Why didn't the Israeli's actually sink the USS Liberty in the first place?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Conor the Bold View Post

    Why attack the USS Liberty with weapons unsuited to sinking the USS Liberty?

    Quote: "At 1431 hours an Israeli Torpedo hit the Liberty midship.........twenty-five more Americans died."

    'The USS Liberty': America's Most Shameful Secret

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    Quote Originally Posted by Breadan O'Connor View Post
    Quote: "At 1431 hours an Israeli Torpedo hit the Liberty midship.........twenty-five more Americans died."

    'The USS Liberty': America's Most Shameful Secret
    Well done Breadan.

    Now explain why USS Liberty was attacked with Napalm and guns by aircraft either returning from missions or being diverted from Close Air support Missions and why not even a single aircraft was carrying iron Bombs.

    Ships aren't sunk by aircraft using cannons or napalm.

    Also, while you're there, why didn't the Israeli's sink the ship in the first place?

    And since you refered to the Torpedo boat incident, can you highlight who opened fire on who first? Was it the Israeli PT boats on Liberty or was it Liberty opening fire on the PT Boats?

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    Don't mind the fake Tipperary Man. He/She probaby resides in Tel Aviv. As for Conor, he/she must be a paid disinfo merchant working for some network of criminal enterprise.

    These are just spoilers. The "mistake" is a favourite word in Israeli lexicon. A "mistake" that lasted for 4 hours while the American Flag flew for the entire attack.

    If it was such as "Mistake" why did LBJ call the captain of a nearby US ship to "call off the wings" -as in, prevent the other US ship in the area from sending aircraft to the USS Liberty's aid?

    New revelations in attack on American spy ship - chicagotribune.com

    [b]The survivors interviewed by the Chicago Tribune uniformly agree that the Liberty was flying the Stars and Stripes before, during and after the attack, except for a brief period in which one flag that had been shot down was replaced with another, larger flag -- the ship's "holiday colors" -- that measured 13 feet long.

    Concludes one of the declassified NSA documents: "Every official interview of numerous Liberty crewmen gave consistent evidence that indeed the Liberty was flying an American flag -- and, further, the weather conditions were ideal to ensure its easy observance and identification."
    The Crew were threatened with court martial or worse (meaning termination of life) if they ever uttered a word about what happened.

    Twenty minutes later, after the Liberty had been hit repeatedly by machine guns, 30 mm cannon and napalm from the Israelis' French-built Mirage and Mystere fighter-bombers, the controller directing the attack asked his chief in Tel Aviv to which country the target vessel belonged.

    "Apparently American," the chief controller replied.


    Fourteen minutes later the Liberty was struck amidships by a torpedo from an Israeli boat, killing 26 of the 100 or so NSA technicians and specialists in Russian and Arabic who were working in restricted compartments below the ship's waterline.



    Analyst: Israelis wanted it sunk

    The transcript published by the Jerusalem Post bore scant resemblance to the one that in 1967 rolled off the teletype machine behind the sealed vault door at Offutt Air Force Base in Omaha, where Steve Forslund worked as an intelligence analyst for the 544th Air Reconnaissance Technical Wing, then the highest-level strategic planning office in the Air Force.

    "The ground control station stated that the target was American and for the aircraft to confirm it," Forslund recalled. "The aircraft did confirm the identity of the target as American, by the American flag.

    "The ground control station ordered the aircraft to attack and sink the target and ensure they left no survivors."

    Forslund said he clearly recalled "the obvious frustration of the controller over the inability of the pilots to sink the target quickly and completely."
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    Politics.ie Member Cellach's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Conor the Bold View Post
    Well done Breadan.

    Now explain why USS Liberty was attacked with Napalm and guns by aircraft either returning from missions or being diverted from Close Air support Missions and why not even a single aircraft was carrying iron Bombs.
    I was under the impression one of the Isreali Mirages fired an Exocet missile into the crew quarters. I think the source was Fisk's Great War for Civilisation.

    Also if the intention behind the attack on the ship was intimidation rather then to sink then it would make sense not to arm the Mirages accordingly.

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