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Thread: Ireland after the economic crash

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    Default Ireland after the economic crash

    After the economic crash, which is well underway, some political and cultural space will paradoxically open up. In general, Ireland tends to be more interesting and diverse when it functions beneath the radar of international capitalism.

    One issue to be cleared up; was there ever a real boom? The answer is; probably not. By 1997, serious cutbacks in the health and social services coupled with some genuinely clever initiatives coming from civil society had engineered a situation wherein there was a current accounts surplus and a low cost base for business. It was time to build on one's strengths in the manner of Finland/nokia and Sweden/various. Instead what happened was a property bubble, and an attempt by the government to dominate sectors like software (Medialab) and the music business (IMRO) with disastrous results. The current generation in power have spent their children's and indeed grandchildren's money.

    Genuine chaos is about to descend. The sub-prime mortgage area is about to hit the US economy, where leverage is much less than Ireland, which will therefore suffer more. The good news is that there will have to be a re-emphasis on cultural belonging, if only because there will be nowhere else to go. While this is going on, we should think about rebuilding as before, but ring-fencing off the possibility of another property bubble, or further incursion by the state into civil society. The end of social partnership with its danger of corporatism will also be a good thing.

    It may be necessary to renegotiate terms of EU and WTO membership, particularly when the IMF “rescue” plan is announced. At a guess, the great majority of the readership here is under 30. How do you see the future?

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    Should make politics interesting anyhow.

    I think any economic slowdown/crash that hits us in the next few years will be small spuds compared to the inpact from Peak Oil and Global warming in the years ahead.

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    I'm a big fan of this "Talking up the Crash" routine. The more the talk ,the more jittery the voters get. the more jittery the voters get, the less likely they are to rock the boat and more likely they are to return us to government for five more years.
    8)
    Keep it up lads. Your doing a great job.

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    Default Re: Ireland after the economic crash

    Quote Originally Posted by erigena
    After the economic crash, which is well underway, some political and cultural space will paradoxically open up. In general, Ireland tends to be more interesting and diverse when it functions beneath the radar of international capitalism.

    One issue to be cleared up; was there ever a real boom? The answer is; probably not. By 1997, serious cutbacks in the health and social services coupled with some genuinely clever initiatives coming from civil society had engineered a situation wherein there was a current accounts surplus and a low cost base for business. It was time to build on one's strengths in the manner of Finland/nokia and Sweden/various. Instead what happened was a property bubble, and an attempt by the government to dominate sectors like software (Medialab) and the music business (IMRO) with disastrous results. The current generation in power have spent their children's and indeed grandchildren's money.

    Genuine chaos is about to descend. The sub-prime mortgage area is about to hit the US economy, where leverage is much less than Ireland, which will therefore suffer more. The good news is that there will have to be a re-emphasis on cultural belonging, if only because there will be nowhere else to go. While this is going on, we should think about rebuilding as before, but ring-fencing off the possibility of another property bubble, or further incursion by the state into civil society. The end of social partnership with its danger of corporatism will also be a good thing.

    It may be necessary to renegotiate terms of EU and WTO membership, particularly when the IMF “rescue” plan is announced. At a guess, the great majority of the readership here is under 30. How do you see the future?
    The end of social partnership with its danger of corporatism will also be a good thing.
    Yes, this much-vaunted 'social partnership' just tied the hands of the many- the unions should take the rap for being acquiescent .
    "Public opinion will be led to adopt, without knowing it, the proposals that we dare not present to them directly ...."
    - V.Giscard D'Estaing, 14 June 2007

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    Quote Originally Posted by hiker
    I'm a big fan of this "Talking up the Crash" routine. The more the talk ,the more jittery the voters get. the more jittery the voters get, the less likely they are to rock the boat and more likely they are to return us to government for five more years.
    8)
    Keep it up lads. Your doing a great job.
    Just what I was thinking but then there is another current which is taking hold in the public imagination and that is desperation. They know the boom is not going to last forever but after 10 years of apparant boom, there is very llittle evidence that there even was a boom. Ourt cities our falling down, the country's health and infrastructure are a mess. 10 years from now, no one will even have the cash they made from selling property.

    Like a man having a midlife crisis, hes going to leave his happily married wife for a young one, just to try something different before he gets old.
    "They take away our freedom in the name of liberty"

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    Quote Originally Posted by Respvblica
    They know the boom is not going to last forever but after 10 years of apparant boom, there is very llittle evidence that there even was a boom.
    Are you seriously taking the piss, like? Very little evidence? How about full employment? Does that not count as evidence? What about the fact that Ireland's young people aren't forced abroad anymore?


    Ourt cities our falling down
    Have you been to the docklands recently? The whole area is brand spanking new. Ballymun has been regenerated, something that never would have happened without the Tiger. The skyline in Limerick now has two fantastic looking towers, thanks to the new money, and Galway has a new central plaza.

    the country's health [is in a mess]
    Well, that certainly isn't for lack of money. Spending has risen by over a billion a year in the last ten years, from €3bn to €15bn.

    and infrastructure are a mess.
    Roads are being built across the country. The luas lines and the Port Tunnel are fully operational. DART and commuter services have been upgraded. Regional trains have been upgraded. Is it perfect? Christ no! But if you're saying the country has gained nothing from the boom, you're talking out your hole.
    The standard of excellence is an infinite suggestiveness, naturalism is the one thing to be condemned.

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    God, LUAS should have been built years before it was built and its still only got two lines. Yes there has been, but for all the money in the country the progress has been mediocre. We could be doing so much better.
    "They take away our freedom in the name of liberty"

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dee Four
    Quote Originally Posted by Respvblica
    They know the boom is not going to last forever but after 10 years of apparant boom, there is very llittle evidence that there even was a boom.
    Are you seriously taking the piss, like? Very little evidence? How about full employment? Does that not count as evidence? What about the fact that Ireland's young people aren't forced abroad anymore?


    Ourt cities our falling down
    Have you been to the docklands recently? The whole area is brand spanking new. Ballymun has been regenerated, something that never would have happened without the Tiger. The skyline in Limerick now has two fantastic looking towers, thanks to the new money, and Galway has a new central plaza.

    [quote:1sqeslkx]the country's health [is in a mess]
    Well, that certainly isn't for lack of money. Spending has risen by over a billion a year in the last ten years, from €3bn to €15bn.

    and infrastructure are a mess.
    Roads are being built across the country. The luas lines and the Port Tunnel are fully operational. DART and commuter services have been upgraded. Regional trains have been upgraded. Is it perfect? Christ no! But if you're saying the country has gained nothing from the boom, you're talking out your hole.[/quote:1sqeslkx]


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    If only Enda Kenny was Taoiseach right!
    The boom could have been spent better but all in all I'm happy with where the money has gone. The Biggest problem with health is a lack of qualified people. not a problem you can just throw money at.
    This notion that there is a massive crash on the way and another depression to follow there after is total verbal diarrhea. the economy is slowing for sure but were the exact same things not being said by the exact same people in 2000/2001.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Respvblica
    Like a man having a midlife crisis, hes going to leave his happily married wife for a young one, just to try something different before he gets old.
    Fking brilliant.
    I'll give a fourth preference in a couple of months just for that one.

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