You're a member of the political elite and you ask the people for their support in a referendum. The people deny you their support so you have a second referendum on exactly the same matter. This time you threaten them with dire consequences if they don't give the answer you want. They cave in and support you.

Do you respect them?

Here Here!! Being honest and confronting the facts is now deemed "defeatist drivel" !?

Im not the one lying to himself here! The last opinion poll showing FF at 23% was proof enough for me that things aint going to change here in a hurry!!!

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Economic Left/Right: -6.75
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -3.44

Was the chemical lobotomy painful?

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"A government big enough to give you everything you want, is strong enough to take everything you have."

Thomas Jefferson

Tradcat I agree with your aspiration that we are capable of good governance if - and thats a big IF - we were to re-cast our politics. However in my experience of the electorate in this country they are by and large conservative, and then on the margins an ubercatholic/neocon style right wing (Ganley, Dana etc.)and an outdated hardcore left (Sinn Fein).

Nowhere do I see the emergence of a credible alternative to the established status quo. Even in this time of economic upheavel Labour will still play second fiddle to either FF or FG. The best chance for improvements in Irish health, education and social policies is to encourage and promote the European influence and negate as much as possible the Anglo/American model in health etc..

Vote YES to Lisbon and keep Ireland central in Europe.

Do you think People should vote Labour at the next general election? Surely you aren't suggesting that they would be any better? Somehow, I reckon, they will be the only ones who escape the backlash of the hole we are in. Labour always seem to dodge bullets that are targeted at the political establishment as a whole, despite the fact that they are an integral part of the same establishment that has buried our economy and attempted to subvert our constitution. They were no less responsible for the travesty against the freely expressed instruction of the people in the last Referendum than FF. If they believed that the people should have a say intheir own governance, they would have fought tooth and nail against a re-run of Lisbon.

Nope. Thats not what they did. Instead they voted to ignore our decision in Brussels, and participated in the cover-up of thug Punchious De Rossa's assault on an Irish citizen. Having called Lisbon dead after the last attempt, they then proceeded to push this treason in spite of the tacit admission that the result last time round should have been final and definitive. They are no better than FF or their sham opposition lackeys FG.

Well...maybe a bit different. I wonder what percentage of TD's in FF or FG are...'ex'....communists?