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Martin: Don’t focus on details of Lisbon

This is a discussion on Martin: Don’t focus on details of Lisbon within the Lisbon Treaty forums, part of the Europe category on Politics.ie. So from Michael Martin's own mouth the government streategy for Lisbon 2 is not to focus on Lisbon at all ...

 
 
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Old 16th January 2009
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Default Martin: Don’t focus on details of Lisbon

So from Michael Martin's own mouth the government streategy for Lisbon 2 is not to focus on Lisbon at all but to attempt to scare the bejesus out of everyone.

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Old 16th January 2009
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Thread about this this already.
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Old 16th January 2009
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Trust me, I'm a Minister...
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Old 16th January 2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kerrynorth View Post
So from Michael Martin's own mouth the government streategy for Lisbon 2 is not to focus on Lisbon at all but to attempt to scare the bejesus out of everyone.

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Bloody marvellous. What fools elected these clowns?
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Old 16th January 2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ibis View Post
Bloody marvellous. What fools elected these clowns?

The same ones who voted NO but hell that's Democracy , have you an alternative system?
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Old 16th January 2009
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Says it all.

This is on a par with the US Congressman defending Nixon to the bitter end with the immortal cry - Don't confuse me with the facts.
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Old 16th January 2009
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People are scared anyway. The referendum will be between fear and anger. Anything can happen. It may will go through this time but if people support it out of fear the long-term damage to our democracy will be substantial.
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Old 16th January 2009
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Originally Posted by MacCoise View Post
The same ones who voted NO but hell that's Democracy , have you an alternative system?
Nope - I'll have to work within the present system for the reversal of both those bad choices.
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Old 16th January 2009
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This is an obvious strategy for ther government (let FG deal with the details)

1) In relation to details, only lawyers, nerds and the utterly dishonest understand them anyway. If you have to explain you are losing.
2) People can download a copy of the bloody thing themselves.
3) Going for the big picture is always far better to sell an International Treaty to people (think stepping stones and the Articles of Association for a Treaty between Great Britain and Ireland - do you think they got bogged down about Treaty Ports, pensions or annunities in 1922?*).
eg
a) Europe has been good to us so far and this is simply the next step to stary part of the inner club.
b) We do not want to be Iceland
c) The Treaty does not change the situation that much anyway, and where it does those who deal with it are happy with the changes.
d) The Foreign affairs position allows us more influence on Gaza.
e) We will use the EU to get the Germans to reduce their Greenhouse emissions after all why should we go it alone?
f) Voting No is bad for the economy.

It may be less honest, but it is far more effective (another round of argunig what Article 48 means, anyone).


*Multitext - "Articles of Agreement as signed, 6 December 1921"
Apparently this is still a recognised International Treaty, despite having being formerly revoked by the Westminster and by us implicitly in 1937.
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Old 16th January 2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kerrynorth View Post
So from Michael Martin's own mouth the government streategy for Lisbon 2 is not to focus on Lisbon at all but to attempt to scare the bejesus out of everyone.

Irish Examiner | Irish News | News from Ireland
It's about trust, you know.
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