Clinton: good for Obama or Clinton 2012?

[cyberianpan]

Noting a lot of Clinton activity lately.

Bill+Hillary get prominent speaking roles at the convention, Hillary gets her roll call.

Politico release a leak from Clinton camp that she wasn't properly considered for VP. This then sets up her surrogates to be outraged on national TV:

CNN

she was deliberately snubbed and the pros and cons of whether it should be her," a former Clinton strategist told CNN's Candy Crowley.

A top Clinton advisor also told CNN they were "outraged," over how the process was conducted.

Former Clinton strategist Paul Begala echoed similar frustrations on CNN Friday night.

Many strongly suspect the rage was contrived and stage managed to fit into the news cycle before announcement of Biden.

ABC reporting on rumours that she is planning 2012 run now. Also I saw on CNN earlier in week that Richardson, Edwards and others were warning her to fully support Obama else they'd go negative on any 2012 bid.

NYT
Early this morning, the McCain campaign released another ad referring to the vice-presidential pick of Senator Barack Obama, but this one features the one he didn’t choose: Senator Hillary Rodham Clinton.

The commercial is titled “Passed Over,” and was released at 3 a.m. today

discussed also on p.ie here

News in today's NYT that Sibelius was on the "short" short list won't help:

NYT
The plans for the announcement began to take shape in early July. Until the end, aides said, a small team inside the Chicago headquarters planned for four possibilities: Mr. Biden, Mr. Bayh, Gov. Tim Kaine of Virginia and Gov. Kathleen Sebelius of Kansas.

Dems must be very worried just what the Clinton convention speeches might contain. Personally I reckon her camp is now running "Clinton 2012" and hopes to damage Obama as much as they can get away with ?

cYp

[Squire Allworthy]

It will be interesting to listen to both the Clintons' speeches. I think they will do what they have to do, and get out of the way, to do anything else would be short sighted. They will praise Obama and urge unity, but the damage will come from the disgruntled Clintonistas and the Sisterhood. A lot of them are not going to vote for Obama, full stop.

Just how much did Clinton want to be the VP? She may think that there is a fair chance that Obama will fail in November. Perhaps she wants to get on with life and pay off her debts, who knows?

Not to at least have made a show of vetting her was unbelievably stupid. McCain is using it to show Obama as petty and spiteful. The mud from these ads is sticking.

As I have said previously this election is the Democrats' to lose.

[ManOfReason]

Noting a lot of Clinton activity lately.

Bill+Hillary get prominent speaking roles at the convention, Hillary gets her roll call.

She got 18 million votes - only an Obamabot would have ever have thought she wouldn't get to speak, and get a roll call, at the DNC.

Politico release a leak from Clinton camp that she wasn't properly considered for VP. This then sets up her surrogates to be outraged on national TV:

CNN

she was deliberately snubbed and the pros and cons of whether it should be her," a former Clinton strategist told CNN's Candy Crowley.

A top Clinton advisor also told CNN they were "outraged," over how the process was conducted.

Former Clinton strategist Paul Begala echoed similar frustrations on CNN Friday night.

I think she earned the right to be seriously considered for the position.

Many strongly suspect the rage was contrived and stage managed to fit into the news cycle before announcement of Biden.

Breaking News - someone on dailykos has a negative opinion of Hillary. What a bunch of group-think losers. Today they have started a campaign to get an AP reporter fired because he wrote a mildly critical article about Obama's VP choice. That site will die with Obama's campaign.

ABC reporting on rumours that she is planning 2012 run now. Also I saw on CNN earlier in week that Richardson, Edwards and others were warning her to fully support Obama else they'd go negative on any 2012 bid.

If Obama loses this campaign Richardson and Edwards and his other supporters will be political history (including Howard Dean).

[Dems must be very worried just what the Clinton convention speeches might contain. Personally I reckon her camp is now running "Clinton 2012" and hopes to damage Obama as much as they can get away with ?

cYp

I'd suggest she won't directly try to damage Obama, but she will put herself in a position to be able to say 'I told you so' should Obama lose.

[cyberianpan]

Not to at least have made a show of vetting her was unbelievably stupid.

It is Clinton's campaign who are leaking that vetting wasn't done and this was significant

CNN
Meanwhile, two sources familiar with Obama's VP search tell CNN's Roland Martin Clinton was very much under consideration, and it's wrong for anyone to suggest that she wasn't.

One of the sources noted the Clintons have lived a very public life, and it's inconceivable for anyone to think that there really is more that needs to be learned from them by requesting additional paperwork, citing the release of documents by her during the primary season.

The other source said both Holder and Kenndey are very familiar with Sen. Clinton and that there was substantive and lengthy conversations among the Obama team with regards to Clinton as vice president.

The Clinton campaign leaks caused a press cycle - Obama's team says he did look at her - now McCain is reaping the rewards. Suspicious.


cYp

[Keith-M]

I'd suggest she won't directly try to damage Obama, but she will put herself in a position to be able to say 'I told you so' should Obama lose.

If she does that, then she can kiss goodbye to any kind of political future. The Democrats are already peed off with the Bill and Hillary show. The increasingly desperate negative campaign she ran towards the even of primary season has as I thought it would be to the detrement of the Democratic party. If she continues like this the negative feelings that many Americans have towards HC will be replicated with the Democratic Party.

[BaudrillardNeverExisted]

I'd suggest she won't directly try to damage Obama, but she will put herself in a position to be able to say 'I told you so' should Obama lose.

The Democrats are already peed off with the Bill and Hillary show.

49% of Democrat-voters beg to differ. Polls towards the end of the primaries showed Obama and Clinton performing similarly against McCain. The difference is Clinton was doing this in the face of a media onslaught rather than gushing praise. I said back then that her electoral map (targetting blue-collar voters in the rust belt) was much more realistic for a Democrat. What happened to all those who were saying that Obama would win "coast-to-coast", "lots of states" and "Nebraska and Wyoming"?

McCain's campaign is using the same "ready to lead" argument as Clinton, and it seems to be getting considerably more traction among the general electorate than it did among the Democrat electorate. If it works she will certainly be in a position to say 'I told you so' and the Democrats would be wise to listen to her.

[Richie Nixon]

I'd suggest she won't directly try to damage Obama, but she will put herself in a position to be able to say 'I told you so' should Obama lose.

The Democrats are already peed off with the Bill and Hillary show.

49% of Democrat-voters beg to differ. Polls towards the end of the primaries showed Obama and Clinton performing similarly against McCain. The difference is Clinton was doing this in the face of a media onslaught rather than gushing praise. I said back then that her electoral map (targetting blue-collar voters in the rust belt) was much more realistic for a Democrat. What happened to all those who were saying that Obama would win "coast-to-coast", "lots of states" and "Nebraska and Wyoming"?

McCain's campaign is using the same "ready to lead" argument as Clinton, and it seems to be getting considerably more traction among the general electorate than it did among the Democrat electorate. If it works she will certainly be in a position to say 'I told you so' and the Democrats would be wise to listen to her.

The American people will not listen. Neither will the democrats. There is already a great distrust for her, and (from talking to Democrats) there will be a huge anti clinton backlash if Obama loses.

This is a last chance for the Democrats, and if they lose in November, they are sunk for the next 20 years

[Squire Allworthy]

Not to at least have made a show of vetting her was unbelievably stupid.

It is Clinton's campaign who are leaking that vetting wasn't done and this was significant

Rumours and spin or is it double spin? The question is was Clinton considered at all in any serious way? If not then someone is likely to voice agitation. If she was then why run with this if it is nonsense? It would be easy to refute. IMO Clinton was never going to get that job. Why pick someone who could seem more credible than yourself with a large swath of support? Someone you really don't like. She was never an option, but a little pretence would have been clever.

Who to believe?

[BaudrillardNeverExisted]

[quote=Richie Nixon]

I'd suggest she won't directly try to damage Obama, but she will put herself in a position to be able to say 'I told you so' should Obama lose.

The Democrats are already peed off with the Bill and Hillary show.

49% of Democrat-voters beg to differ. Polls towards the end of the primaries showed Obama and Clinton performing similarly against McCain. The difference is Clinton was doing this in the face of a media onslaught rather than gushing praise. I said back then that her electoral map (targetting blue-collar voters in the rust belt) was much more realistic for a Democrat. What happened to all those who were saying that Obama would win "coast-to-coast", "lots of states" and "Nebraska and Wyoming"?

McCain's campaign is using the same "ready to lead" argument as Clinton, and it seems to be getting considerably more traction among the general electorate than it did among the Democrat electorate. If it works she will certainly be in a position to say 'I told you so' and the Democrats would be wise to listen to her.

(from talking to Democrats) there will be a huge anti clinton backlash if Obama loses.
[/quote:1xwsbm5q]



If Democrats are that irrational, they deserve 20 years in the cold. If Obama loses it's Obama's fault.

[Clareman]

Michigan and Florida are getting full votes at the convention, the credentials commitee approved it today.