I hate cyclists!

[alonso]

NDS that sounds ridiculous. Was there any poetic licence in that post?

I'm not saying it applies in your example but there are numerous locations around Dublin where the use of the segregated cycle lanes is in fact more dangerous for both cyclists and motorists, especially as they go through junctions. This should be borne in mind by all you motorists out there who haven't sat on a bike since your school days. The roads would be far safer if everyone had at least one cycle a week aroiund some of our urban centres.

[Pax]

More anecdotal evidence from NDS I could spew forth the same stuff on pedestrians repeatedly using the cycling lane, particularly on carriage-way overpasses. It still wouldn't get us anywhere on the actual verifiable statistics on safe cycling or not. Which brings in Pidge's link to stats on low numbers of deaths from cycling above..

[joemomma]

Cyclists always complain about how unfair other road users are to them. The truth is simple: the biggest cause of cycling accidents, and the biggest cause of cycling accidents, are cyclists themselves.

The only problem with that statement is that it's not actually true, is it?

I actually don't like inconsiderate cyclists either, but by any measure an inconsiderate cyclist represents less of a threat than an inconsiderate motorist. Cyclists and motorists are equally subject to the rules of the road, so if you have a problem with the behaviour you witness, why don't you ask the guards to put more of their time into enforcing the rules for cyclists than motorists? I expect you'll be told that they concentrate their efforts on the most dangerous and/or disruptive activities, i.e. breaches by motorists.

The main reason I don't like inconsiderate cyclists is that they make life difficult for the rest of us. When a motorist endangers my life by breaking the rules of the road, I tend to get angry and shout at him or her. Of course this is only for my own benefit, as I know that in 99% of cases, the motorist will be blissfully unaware that he or she has done anything wrong and simply put me down as another "aggressive cyclist".

[NotDevsSon]

Cyclists always complain about how unfair other road users are to them. The truth is simple: the biggest cause of cycling accidents, and the biggest cause of cycling accidents, are cyclists themselves.

The only problem with that statement is that it's not actually true, is it?

According to the gardai it is.

They find that the majority of fatal accidents involving cyclists involve cyclists who have broken lights and been hit by oncoming cars, cyclists who cycle on footpaths and then swerve out onto the road in front of oncoming cars, cyclists who cycle out of gateways without checking oncoming cars, and similar accidents.

Another major contributory factor is cyclists who do not wear reflective clothing at night, and so who are not seen by other traffic.

I actually don't like inconsiderate cyclists either, but by any measure an inconsiderate cyclist represents less of a threat than an inconsiderate motorist. Cyclists and motorists are equally subject to the rules of the road, so if you have a problem with the behaviour you witness, why don't you ask the guards to put more of their time into enforcing the rules for cyclists than motorists? I expect you'll be told that they concentrate their efforts on the most dangerous and/or disruptive activities, i.e. breaches by motorists.

You miss the point. The problem is that the majority of cyclists, in garda experience, and in my experience, break the rules of the road and put themselves and others in danger. A minority of car drivers do the same. If however a car driver breaks the rules of the road he is less likely to die as a result than a cyclist who breaks the rules of the road is.

The main reason I don't like inconsiderate cyclists is that they make life difficult for the rest of us. When a motorist endangers my life by breaking the rules of the road, I tend to get angry and shout at him or her. Of course this is only for my own benefit, as I know that in 99% of cases, the motorist will be blissfully unaware that he or she has done anything wrong and simply put me down as another "aggressive cyclist".

The problem is that where at least there are certain control mechanisms with other vehicle users (penalty points, losing a licence) there are no control mechanisms with cyclists. In addition other vehicle users use the road and except in very rare circumstances the correct side of the road, cyclists need no training, need no licence and cycle on roads (including on the wrong side of the roads), footpaths, grass margins etc (one guard told me he once got a call from a member of the public who had a cyclist cycle through their garden and out the back gate as a short cut to avoid the journey around the housing estate!) and rarely obey ANY of the traffic rules. We need to be encouraging SAFE cyclists and get the reckless ones off the roadways, footpath, grass margins and everywhere else.

On of the phenomena concerning cyclists (and this thread shows it) is the extent to which they are denial that there is a problem, and constantly slip into "but what about?" whining about other people. Yes there are problems with others. THIS is about cyclists' behaviour. Talk to most drivers and most pedestrians and they will have no problem talking about the number of idiots driving or walking. But give out about cyclists and many cyclists seem to go into complete denial about the fact that there is a very real problem with a large number of cyclists, in the experience of gardai the great majority. One senior guard said to me once that if the gardai arrested all the cyclists in Dublin who break the law daily they'd be no room in jails for anyone else!

[EoinMn]

We need to be encouraging SAFE cyclists and get the reckless ones off the roadways, footpath, grass margins and everywhere else.

Safe cycling campaigns are being run by cycling groups, such as the GCC in Galway, all over Ireland.

[EoinMn]

Talk to most drivers and most pedestrians and they will have no problem talking about the number of idiots driving or walking.

Well I disagree there.. as a motorist I have plenty to say about other idiotic motorists!

[joemomma]

Cyclists always complain about how unfair other road users are to them. The truth is simple: the biggest cause of cycling accidents, and the biggest cause of cycling accidents, are cyclists themselves.

The only problem with that statement is that it's not actually true, is it?

According to the gardai it is.

They find that the majority of fatal accidents involving cyclists involve cyclists who have broken lights and been hit by oncoming cars, cyclists who cycle on footpaths and then swerve out onto the road in front of oncoming cars, cyclists who cycle out of gateways without checking oncoming cars, and similar accidents.

Another major contributory factor is cyclists who do not wear reflective clothing at night, and so who are not seen by other traffic.

Your reference for all this?

You miss the point. The problem is that the majority of cyclists, in garda experience, and in my experience, break the rules of the road and put themselves and others in danger. A minority of car drivers do the same. If however a car driver breaks the rules of the road he is less likely to die as a result than a cyclist who breaks the rules of the road is.

Correct. They are also much more likely to kill somebody else.

On of the phenomena concerning cyclists (and this thread shows it) is the extent to which they are denial that there is a problem, and constantly slip into "but what about?" whining about other people. Yes there are problems with others. THIS is about cyclists' behaviour. Talk to most drivers and most pedestrians and they will have no problem talking about the number of idiots driving or walking. But give out about cyclists and many cyclists seem to go into complete denial about the fact that there is a very real problem with a large number of cyclists, in the experience of gardai the great majority.

Sorry, but the whole point of my post was to agree that I don't approve of inconsiderate cyclists any more than you do. You seem sure that such cyclists are in a majority, which I don't necessarily concede (although I agree such behaviour is prevalent), but why on earth should I, as a responsible cyclist, be expected to accept responsibility for breaches of the rules of the road by other cyclists? I'm also a motorist and a pedestrian, I certainly don't accept responsibility for breaches by other motorists and pedestrians.

[Eddiepops]

Where the hell is NDS driving? I've been cycling on Dublin streets since fourth year in school and NEVER have I seen anything approaching the madcap adventures he attributes to the obviously homicidal maniacs that use bikes in his area. I'm beginning to think he has seriously pissed off some key cyclists a few years ago and now they're following him around trying to cause an accident, or make him have a heart attack brought on by righteous indignation

[Bray Head]

I drive and cycle around Dublin and I find that I have much better hearing on the bike than in the car. I think it's to do with cars having an engine, windows and a roof.

Yes - but you NEED that hearing much more because you don't have mirrors, bumpers or airbags like you do in a car. On the bike I rely heavily on hearing not just to warn me that a vehicle is coming up behind me, but also to warn me what size it is from the sound of the engine.

I'm a cyclist and I quite regularly break traffic lights, and to be honest it's quite often safe to do so. Motorists forget that at junctions cyclists have much better vision than they do and can generally come to a stop faster than a car can. Lights are generally sequenced so conservatively that it's quite safe to slip round a left-hand turn quite safely. The same goes for pedestrian crossings, many of which go green even when there's no pedestrians preparing to cross.

As a motorist the biggest problem I have is with cyclists who wear no reflective gear or lights at night. I would say that at least 2/3 are either not lit at all or not nearly bright enough. These people fail to realise that they are occupying the road and just cannot be seen at all. I've yet to see a cyclist stopped by a guard for this (or for any other matter as it happens).

[Bray Head]

Coming up to Drumcondra one night in a taxi we were stuck behind some cyclist who completely blocked up the lane where he was cycling.

Take a chill pill dude.

I've tried using that cycle lane, it's difficult to access, badly marked, difficult to exit from and is FULL OF PEDESTRIANS who don't make the distinction between path and cycle lane. So that's why I use the bus lane at that point (which I am entitled to do).

You would know something about the appalling quality of cycle lanes in this country if you'd ever tried using them.