Public transport

[MichaelR]

Despite the "density" mantra, I believe public transport is largely a matter of poltical will. There is enough density in lots of places presently not served, but people have learned to depend on cars and would need to gradually adapt to the availability of buses. So councils should promote at least pilot schemes.

Does any party push something like this? I'd go help them in the locals. On the local level I would personally see this as the single most important issue.

I expected the Greens would be like that. But I see a lot of Greens on this site and they don't mention the issue.

(And unlike massive rail projects, suburban/rural bus pilots are something that can be done in the short term. By "rural" I don't mean WAY out but up to 30 km to the cities, where most people commute anyway).

[Kate P]

The Rural Transport Initiative is managed by Pobal and run by development organisations across the country. They make a huge impact on the lives of rural dwellers - particularly older people.

But there will never be a RTI designed to deal with commuting - that's what public transport services do. And you'll probably find that there are many private bus companies that do exactly what you're suggesting.

It would be impossible to serve outlying areas of cities as efficiently as cities themselves, so there will always be commuters whose needs aren't met.

There's no point in me taking the train from where I live to Dublin to catch a play I can't see here, for example because they leave the city too early. Even if I drove to Kildare or Newbridge to take the Arrow. I'd still have to leave before the final curtain.

Likewise for shift workers such as factory operatives, nurses, gardai, firemen, salespeople... It's really only viable for 9-5 workers.

[MichaelR]

But there will never be a RTI designed to deal with commuting - that's what public transport services do. And you'll probably find that there are many private bus companies that do exactly what you're suggesting.

Unfortunately I never heard of any here around Limerick.

To take a specific example, Adare has a lot housing estates, and while the area in general is known as expensive, the estates seem largely middle class. These people commute to Limerick daily, on cars. The only bus service are the Tralee and Killarney buses, which are very infrequent and most importantly stop at a point quite far from the housing estates (next to the tourist office).

I suspect that a bus service (mostly around the 9-5 schedule) would pick up steam there. But it might require initial subsidies as the people would not *immediately* flock to it.

It would be impossible to serve outlying areas of cities as efficiently as cities themselves, so there will always be commuters whose needs aren't met.

Well, even if only 60-70% of the commuters were able to take the service because of the schedule, and only half of them actually did, it would still take a lot of car load off the roads - and that would happen at peak time, when the roads are most clogged and therefore each car makes most pollution.

I'm not saying that public transport should aim to displace the car totally. Rather, it should be a viable alternative for typical cases.

[Kate P]

But there will never be a RTI designed to deal with commuting - that's what public transport services do. And you'll probably find that there are many private bus companies that do exactly what you're suggesting.

Unfortunately I never heard of any here around Limerick.

To take a specific example, Adare has a lot housing estates, and while the area in general is known as expensive, the estates seem largely middle class. These people commute to Limerick daily, on cars. The only bus service are the Tralee and Killarney buses, which are very infrequent and most importantly stop at a point quite far from the housing estates (next to the tourist office).

I suspect that a bus service (mostly around the 9-5 schedule) would pick up steam there. But it might require initial subsidies as the people would not *immediately* flock to it.

It would be impossible to serve outlying areas of cities as efficiently as cities themselves, so there will always be commuters whose needs aren't met.

Well, even if only 60-70% of the commuters were able to take the service because of the schedule, and only half of them actually did, it would still take a lot of car load off the roads - and that would happen at peak time, when the roads are most clogged and therefore each car makes most pollution.

I'm not saying that public transport should aim to displace the car totally. Rather, it should be a viable alternative for typical cases.

It should be a viable alternative for typical cases - or at least it could be. I'm surprised that there isn't a private bus service at Adare if it is as you describe but I imagine that it wouldn't be hard to set one up if there's a need for it. That's part of the problem though - assessing the needs of commuters. I know with the RTIs that many of the services run on pension day, stopping outside people's houses and dropping them back to the door.

There are other issues for commuters that make it viable to car pool or organise a bus - such as heavy traffic or lack of parking. Or even the length of the commute makes it worthwhile having someone else do the driving. Not sure how Adare fits into that mould.
Have you looked into it?

[joel]

The Rural Transport Initiative is managed by Pobal and run by development organisations across the country. They make a huge impact on the lives of rural dwellers - particularly older people.

But there will never be a RTI designed to deal with commuting - that's what public transport services do. And you'll probably find that there are many private bus companies that do exactly what you're suggesting.

It would be impossible to serve outlying areas of cities as efficiently as cities themselves, so there will always be commuters whose needs aren't met.

There's no point in me taking the train from where I live to Dublin to catch a play I can't see here, for example because they leave the city too early. Even if I drove to Kildare or Newbridge to take the Arrow. I'd still have to leave before the final curtain.

Likewise for shift workers such as factory operatives, nurses, gardai, firemen, salespeople... It's really only viable for 9-5 workers.

Well that is not a lot of use for people without cars, is it. How can you get people to move about in the evening without later-running trains?

[seabhcan]

But there will never be a RTI designed to deal with commuting - that's what public transport services do. And you'll probably find that there are many private bus companies that do exactly what you're suggesting.

Unfortunately I never heard of any here around Limerick.

To take a specific example, Adare has a lot housing estates, and while the area in general is known as expensive, the estates seem largely middle class. These people commute to Limerick daily, on cars. The only bus service are the Tralee and Killarney buses, which are very infrequent and most importantly stop at a point quite far from the housing estates (next to the tourist office).

I suspect that a bus service (mostly around the 9-5 schedule) would pick up steam there. But it might require initial subsidies as the people would not *immediately* flock to it.

It would be impossible to serve outlying areas of cities as efficiently as cities themselves, so there will always be commuters whose needs aren't met.

Well, even if only 60-70% of the commuters were able to take the service because of the schedule, and only half of them actually did, it would still take a lot of car load off the roads - and that would happen at peak time, when the roads are most clogged and therefore each car makes most pollution.

I'm not saying that public transport should aim to displace the car totally. Rather, it should be a viable alternative for typical cases.

Sounds like a good idea. Why not write to your local councillor and see what they say (local elections coming up soon). You could also start a petition in the Adare estates...

[cactus flower]

Buses are the only thing for Ireland due to low pop densities and will usually only get people out of cars if within 10 minutes of their home at 10 minute intervals. This would still potentially include a lot of areas not currently served by buses.

Some towns are inevitably too small for public transport - Green policy is at risk of preventing them from ever gaining enough critical mass to make it viable.

[MichaelR]

Sounds like a good idea. Why not write to your local councillor and see what they say (local elections coming up soon). You could also start a petition in the Adare estates...

I would not do the latter as I don't live there. Where I live (not far from there), the density argument may have value; more importantly, most people around are of the 40-50 year old generation and, apparently, attach an emotional value to commuting independently by car. (I won't name my address in the open forum, obviously).

I've checked the council website. No Greens. Adare has councillors living locally, PD and FF.

I'll try checking with the Cllrs especially as they have official emails. Barring that - should I try the Green HQ, suggesting that running a public transport campaign might build up enough appeal to get a Cllr in next year?

[seabhcan]

You could run for the council yourself.

One big problem is that many Irish people see using public transport as akin to public disgrace - but that attitude is changing slowly.

[greengoose]

Public transport and Ireland should never be in the same sentence