Making cycling safer

[Dorris]

Seen an epic beatdown of a cyclist last summer out in Rialto. Your man with the tour de France gear went crashing through a red light and avoided a woman and her child by a matter of inches, she shouted gobsh1te at him and he shouted slag back. And with that just up the road the womans husband/brother/boyfriend whatever ran over to him and knocked him clean off the bike with a punch to the face. He made the cyclist apoligise to the woman for almost knocking her and the kid over, very funny stuff if a little harsh but i'm sure the cyclist will think twice the next time.

I'm sure you'll inform me what "tour de France gear", they tend to have more than one gear!! , "went crashing through a red light", was the light repaired afterwards?

"by a matter of inches", there are a lot of inches available!! She must have being doing well to be going out with her husbands brothers boyfriend, are you sure it wasn't a handbag he used.

So with all that and only a small element of ridicule I'm calling bull ************************. I am waiting for the day some one swings at me, actually no, it did happen and I hunted him down in 5 seconds and he got what he gave me and more. So when you assume that this is a safe option, to attack what may be a fierce fit athlete, remember that consequences may ensue.


I'm likely to read more nonsense on this thread than any other I'll read this or any other year and there is no such thing as road tax and and and whatever, it is probably not worth wasting my time reading the whole thread, although I have seen a few wise heads in here, but the particular post I've replied to has that element that needs to be gone for.

[Partizan]

The cyclist who nearly runs me over will get a good thrashing from myself.

[jman0war]

Motorists can and are regularly prosecuted for violation of the rules of the road, they are also registered, pay tax and are licenced and identifiable. Cyclists are not it is time that they were tested, licenced, paid road tax and made to realise that the rules of the road apply to all road users not just motorists.

Problem is the rules of the road as well as their design is not to benefit cyclists.
It's for the benefit of motorized traffic.
One-way streets in every city centre?
Current road-layout and rules are little more than obstructions to both cyclists and pedestrians.
Thus people are voting with their feet, or their wheels as the case may be.

[Nebuchadnezzar]

Motorists can and are regularly prosecuted for violation of the rules of the road, they are also registered, pay tax and are licenced and identifiable. Cyclists are not it is time that they were tested, licenced, paid road tax and made to realise that the rules of the road apply to all road users not just motorists.

Can we explore this bike road tax notion for a moment - I pay 677euros on my car - so what would be fair for a bike?

Using very rough figures on the back of a fag packet -

Starting off with 677euros lets factor that to reflect the power of the propulsion unit - my car 139hp, me on my bike about .1hp, thats a 1390:1 ratio so that would be 49 cents(rounding up).

But to do this properly we should also factor in the road space occupied -

My car takes up 8m2 approx , me on my bike 1m2 - 8:1 ratio, so 49 cents becomes 6 cents(approx).

Now factor in the fact that the fuel used are very different and in the case of the bike are mostly home produced and the waste by-products are easily bio-degradable - I think a 2:1 factor would be reasonable, so that makes it 3 cents.

There are various other factors which should also ideally be factored in (general enhancement of health, social capital, community integration etc) but factoring below 3 cents would start to make things a little silly(in my opinion).

[ruamruam]

Can we explore this bike road tax notion for a moment - I pay 677euros on my car - so what would be fair for a bike?

Using very rough figures on the back of a fag packet -

Starting off with 677euros lets factor that to reflect the power of the propulsion unit - my car 139hp, me on my bike about .1hp, thats a 1390:1 ratio so that would be 49 cents(rounding up).

But to do this properly we should also factor in the road space occupied -

My car takes up 8m2 approx , me on my bike 1m2 - 8:1 ratio, so 49 cents becomes 6 cents(approx).

Now factor in the fact that the fuel used are very different and in the case of the bike are mostly home produced and the waste by-products are easily bio-degradable - I think a 2:1 factor would be reasonable, so that makes it 3 cents.

There are various other factors which should also ideally be factored in (general enhancement of health, social capital, community integration etc) but factoring below 3 cents would start to make things a little silly(in my opinion).

The most insightful post on this thread.

The medical costs of rehabilitating accident victims has not been factored into the equation. I am aware that cyclists cause accidents but I think if you visit any hospital or the National Rehabilitation Hospital in Dun Laoghaire you will find relatively few there because of an accident caused by a cyclist. Plenty caused by car drivers. Rehabilitating accident victims does not come cheap. And I am only talking about the monetary costs, the social cost of accidents cannot be measured in monetary terms as I know from personal experience.

Generally speaking the cyclist will be fitter so less likely to have heart attacks or be obese. People who exercise generally have better mental health as exercise reduces stress. Therefore less strain on our health services.

When you purchase a car you have to spend thousands of euros on a car, most of which goes out of the country to the car manufacturer, you need to buy petrol/diesel to run it. More money leaving the country. A bike can be bought for one 100 euros and costs almost nothing to run.

We should also factor in the costs of global warming?

If we could get an actuary to measure the cost of driving versus cycling and each to pay according, I as a cyclist would gladly pay my share of road tax. Actually I think it would be a good idea.

[Nolte]

I agree - can we include motorists whilst we're at it?

can we also include pedestrians?
so that's cyclists, pedestrian and drivers.
although the thing with pedestrians and dangerousness, is that they are the biggest threat to themselves rather than some one else.
but their is abuse of the rules of the road by all types of users of the roads.

Motorists can and are regularly prosecuted for violation of the rules of the road, they are also registered, pay tax and are licenced and identifiable.

unless of course their license plate on their car is unreadable due to dirt which i find is common

Can we explore this bike road tax notion for a moment - I pay 677euros on my car - so what would be fair for a bike?

Using very rough figures on the back of a fag packet -

Starting off with 677euros lets factor that to reflect the power of the propulsion unit - my car 139hp, me on my bike about .1hp, thats a 1390:1 ratio so that would be 49 cents(rounding up).

But to do this properly we should also factor in the road space occupied -

My car takes up 8m2 approx , me on my bike 1m2 - 8:1 ratio, so 49 cents becomes 6 cents(approx).

Now factor in the fact that the fuel used are very different and in the case of the bike are mostly home produced and the waste by-products are easily bio-degradable - I think a 2:1 factor would be reasonable, so that makes it 3 cents.

There are various other factors which should also ideally be factored in (general enhancement of health, social capital, community integration etc) but factoring below 3 cents would start to make things a little silly(in my opinion).

you forget to factor in weight. this along with horse power factors in the wear & tear on the road.
let's see say the cyclist is 65 Kg and the bike is 10kg. that's 75kg. a car's weight is 1,500kg so this is 20 times the weight of a bicycle,. so let's round it to a shiny cent

[ringolevio]

It is about time that cyclists like in the Netherlands were required to take out insurance.

*ducks before the mob of cyclist bullyboys go apeshyt and start throwing things*

As a cyclist in the Netherlands I have to say you're speaking through the wrong orifice

[alonso]

The behaviour of many cyclists is appaling. I live in an apartment building beside a very busy and very dangerous dual carriageway. I constantly see cyclists shoot straight out of the building and across the road without looking.

Beside me at work there is a one-way street. It is clearly marked. But everyone using it has to dodge idiots on bikes cycling the wrong way up it. One morning I counted four of them at the one time using it the wrong way. It is one way for a reason. There is another road opening up onto it at an angle so someone leaving it on a bike, motorbike or car, CANNOT SEE what is coming from their right. One cyclist was killed at that stop last year by a car coming out. The cyclist was 100% at fault. Because it is so dangerous guards sometimes stroll down there. Cyclists go apeshyt if they are stopped, as if they have some godgiven right to cycle where they want, when they want. One of them last summer got arrested for verbally abusing a guard who stopped him - they began shouting and swearing and I heard later the cyclist called the guard a "country cu*t!" (One work colleague was walking down the road at the time and witnessed it.)

It is about time the rules of the road were enforced. Maybe if the guards started confiscating the bikes of maniacs who endanger themselves afterwards and everyone else it would bring home the message. Idiots who are a danger to themselves and othes shouldn't be let cycle - period.

Jaysus Tommy you seem to have a personal link to more cyclists deaths than there are cyclists!!!!
Just out of curiosity, where did this fatality take place?
I ask because there was only one cyclist killed last year in Dublin. I know where it was and it does not seem to fit your description.

Provide a link to an article which describes it. Thanks.

I think it would be a shame if you were making up tragedies to fit your sick, twisted little agenda and your anti-environmental mindset. If your story is indeed true, it should be easy to find the report on the IT archive. And if you are stating that the cyclist was 100% at fault, you need to provide evidence. To slander the dead with no basis is sick.

[councilkid]

On the tax for cyclist option, I'd also want to factor in the infrastructure requirements for cyclists versus cars, exhaust pollution, traffic congestion, noise and just the general pain in the backside that a city clogged up with what are basically rolling road blocks during peak times.

[myksav]

Keith, not often that I agree with but you are spot on here. I have nearly been run over three times since Xmas, 1 guy on a footpath and the other breaking the lights. Last week I was nearly walloped by some eejit on a bike at the junction of Wicklow and Kevin Street. Your man just tore through the red light and nearly hit me crossing the pedestrian lights on the green man. I let a roar at him but he just laughed in my face. ************************************g ************************ers.

Ah, children, children, children, take the earphones out of your ears and try looking where you're going when you're walking.

Oh yeah, try looking around first when you step off the kerb as well.

by the way, you can short out a new type car engine with low level EMP. Might start marketing the device to cyclists.