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Thread: Could immigration split Sinn Fein's vote?

  1. #1
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    Could immigration split Sinn Fein's vote?

    Like most parties in Ireland, Sinn Fein seems to have a fairly pro-immigrant stance. It believes in equality and rights for those arriving in Ireland from many different parts. It seems likely, that if such immigration continues for the foreseeable future, Ireland’s culture will have to remould itself substantially to absorb and meld these newcomers into a common identity that everyone feels is equally theirs. The alternative would seem to be the emergence of a patchwork quilt of mult-culturalism in which there are many competing identities but little in the way of a common bond.

    Either way much of the racial/cultural dimensions of Ireland’s Gaelic heritage will no longer predominate. In the first scenario, to form a common identity between those of varying racial and cultural backgrounds, the slate will most likely have to be wiped clean. To allow Gaelicism to dominate any future cultural outlook would surely result in a hierarchy of identities where some would be considered more Irish than others. In much the same way as most of the inhabitants of London’s present day East-end wouldn’t feel very Anglo-Saxon, I doubt very many future Irishmen whose ancestors hailed from India or China are going to feel like Gaels. As the former can no doubt feel they’re English, just not Anglo-Saxon English, the latter may well feel Irish without the Gaelic dimension. It seems to me that both Anglo-Saxon and Gaelic identities have and will become to be seen as restrictive, never mind exclusive, ethnic identities within England/UK and Ireland.

    So if a new identity is not to be forged amongst the many strands of people that will come to form the Ireland of the future, it seems that fracture into a divided society will be the negative alternative. True, there will still be revivialist Gaelic culture with Gaelsoileanna, Gaelic names and political parties similarly titled but this will surely be one competing element in a mass of identities, each as equally strident in their separate ethnicity. A narrow Gaelic identity today will become but one patch on a quilt of many patches in sharp contrast to the melting pots that exist in constitutional republics such as the USA.

    The inconsistency I see is that Sinn Fein seems to stand for both mutually exclusive futures. On the one hand their quest for a united Ireland seems to be based on a revival of a profoundly mono-cultural/racial past. What other reasoning is there for a united Ireland other than the re-unity of an island and people with a common Gaelic heritage? It can’t surely be for the sake of economies of scale or the inconvenience of borders or they’d be calling for a united Europe. Why unity with the North and its people and not, say, Iceland? Because one group shares our cultural/racial heritage and the other doesn’t.

    So, many voters support both Sinn Fein and the unity and revival of this island’s Gaelic identity.

    But what of those that support the party’s pro-immigrant stance and – possibly unwittingly – either of the two very different futures this stance will likely lead us towards? Surely immigration will require a change to a less prescribed identity possibly looking towards laws and institutions to form a common bond. Or, it will result in a variety of competing narrow ethno-cultural groups. But either way, a Gaelic identity will not define the cultural outlook of all this country’s inhabitants.

    So, in time, will the party be forced to review such a contradictory outlook or lose one or both sets of supporters? Could rifts develop between the mono-culturalists, the multi-culturalists and those with a less identity based and more civic minded republicanism? Maybe the last two visions are incompatible with the party’s founding ideals?

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    "....their quest for a united Ireland seems to be based on a revival of a profoundly mono-cultural/racial past"

    LOL......

    Ah seriously Tide, if you're going to discuss Sinn Féin policy, then at least make the effort to examine it first.....go to http://www.sinnfein.ie.....it's not a secret you know!!

    Sinn Féin recognises the need for an Irish Immigration Policy that is fair and grounded in the best practices of international human rights. What there is in the 26 Counties at present is a draconian anti-immigration policy masquerading as an Immigration Act to keep potential migrants out of Ireland.

    Sinn Féin recognises that the question of immigration is both emotive and complex.

    * We call on the Irish Government to engage in urgent dialogue with immigrant organisations;

    * And for the authorities to make immigration legislation presently being drafted open to public scrutiny and subordinate to humanitarian considerations.



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    Politics.ie Regular Catalpa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mellows
    "....their quest for a united Ireland seems to be based on a revival of a profoundly mono-cultural/racial past"

    LOL......

    Ah seriously Tide, if you're going to discuss Sinn Féin policy, then at least make the effort to examine it first.....go to http://www.sinnfein.ie.....it's not a secret you know!!

    Sinn Féin recognises the need for an Irish Immigration Policy that is fair and grounded in the best practices of international human rights. What there is in the 26 Counties at present is a draconian anti-immigration policy masquerading as an Immigration Act to keep potential migrants out of Ireland.

    Sinn Féin recognises that the question of immigration is both emotive and complex.

    * We call on the Irish Government to engage in urgent dialogue with immigrant organisations;

    * And for the authorities to make immigration legislation presently being drafted open to public scrutiny and subordinate to humanitarian considerations.



    What there is in the 26 Counties at present is a draconian anti-immigration policy masquerading as an Immigration Act to keep potential migrants out of Ireland.


    Seeing as 100,000 or so immigrants have entered the State in the last 12 months that statement can only mean SF consider it should be even higher.

    Or else they are just telling bare faced lies!
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    Quote Originally Posted by Catalpa
    Seeing as 100,000 or so immigrants have entered the State in the last 12 months that statement can only mean SF consider it should be even higher.

    Or else they are just telling bare faced lies!
    Or maybe they're just not as well informed as yourself.... :wink:
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    Catalpa

    Maybe you support dragging children from school and deporting them in their school uniforms? Maybe you support the idea of keeping people living in fear?

    I do not. That is not a proper immigration policy!

    We need a proper immigration policy. Do you not agree?

    We need one that is rights based? Do you not agree?

    Where do you get the notion that Sinn Féin are calling for higher levels of immigration? That is simply not so. But Sinn Féin are very clearly calling for a proper rights based immigration policy, are campaigning against racism and against the brutal unjust treatment and deportation campaign that McDowell favours in place of a proper immigration policy.

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    Sinn Fein is a pro-immigrant party but the future this will result in stands in sharp contrast with the basis for a united Ireland.

    What is the cornerstone for the quest for a united Ireland? History.

    What will be the result of continuous immigration? A dramatic break with that history.

    A multi-cultural or solely civic republic in the decades to come will have removed the very basis for Sinn Fein’s outlook – a Gaelic identity that seeks unity with an area and people of the same Gaelic identity.

    Will an Irishman of Chinese or Indian descent see the need to unify with the people of the North any more than the people of Iceland?

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    Politics.ie Regular Catalpa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pluralist
    Quote Originally Posted by Catalpa
    Seeing as 100,000 or so immigrants have entered the State in the last 12 months that statement can only mean SF consider it should be even higher.

    Or else they are just telling bare faced lies!
    Or maybe they're just not as well informed as yourself.... :wink:
    It's common knowledge Chiefo>

    All I'm asking is if 100,000 immigrants + a year is an acceptable figure or not to SF, or do they want to see even more arrive here annually as their web site would strongly suggest?

    If they do want to see 100,000 + a year then let them put up Posters all around Dublin at the time of the next G.E. highlighting this. :wink:

    Some Chance! :P

    But the SF Faiteacháns here are too scared to tackle the Immigration Question head on so they will shy off on this Post as per usual!
    Europa Conventus Delenda Est

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    Seeing as we're yet again talking about immigration, could Catalpa please answer the following question - if inward migration was drastically reduced (which seems to be your wish), who's going to do the low-paid, minimum-wagejobs that keeping the economy moving forwards and our competitiveness rating relatively strong? Coz they won't do themselves, you know.....
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    Politics.ie Regular Catalpa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mellows
    Catalpa

    Maybe you support dragging children from school and deporting them in their school uniforms? Maybe you support the idea of keeping people living in fear?

    I do not. That is not a proper immigration policy!

    We need a proper immigration policy. Do you not agree?

    We need one that is rights based? Do you not agree?

    Where do you get the notion that Sinn Féin are calling for higher levels of immigration? That is simply not so. But Sinn Féin are very clearly calling for a proper rights based immigration policy, are campaigning against racism and against the brutal unjust treatment and deportation campaign that McDowell favours in place of a proper immigration policy.

    The rights of Irish people are being forgotten in all of this.

    We are being turned into a minority in our own Country.

    If your a true Irishman you wouldn't support this nonesense.

    The people who are deported in such a fashion have spent years going through the Asylum process and have eventually had their many appeals heard and rejected.

    They are requested to leave and those that fail to do so are then deported.

    Sure its a hard decision and of course people get hurt, esp. the kids.

    But we can't let the whole world in you do accept that don't you?

    If you say there should be a No Deportations Policy then effectively you are supporting an Open Door Policy.

    So which is it :
    Europa Conventus Delenda Est

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    Quote Originally Posted by hiding behind a poster
    who's going to do the low-paid, minimum-wagejobs that keeping the economy moving forwards and our competitiveness rating relatively strong? Coz they won't do themselves, you know.....
    Low paid jobs should either pay more or else be exported. We don't want a low wage economy. Genuine competitiveness comes through increased skill levels, increased efficiencies and technological advances
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