Bobby Sands R.I.P.

[edifice.]

Bobby Sands was and still is a very important figure in Irish history. Many are of the opinion that he was the first step in stopping the troubles. When Gerry Adams etc. saw the huge votes that won Bobby Sands the election is Fermanagh-South Tyrone as well as the elections other hunger strikers won North and South of the border, he and SF realised that they could be much more effective if they used the ballot box instead of the gun. Before Bobby Sands they would never have thought of that. To dismiss him as simply being a terrorist shows a lack of understanding of Irish history. When you look at the changes that occured in Ireland over the 20th century, I would say that Bobby Sands would be as important a figure as Pearse and Connelly were in 1916

And another one crawls out of the woodwork.

[bobbysands81]

Bobby Sands was and still is a very important figure in Irish history. Many are of the opinion that he was the first step in stopping the troubles. When Gerry Adams etc. saw the huge votes that won Bobby Sands the election is Fermanagh-South Tyrone as well as the elections other hunger strikers won North and South of the border, he and SF realised that they could be much more effective if they used the ballot box instead of the gun. Before Bobby Sands they would never have thought of that. To dismiss him as simply being a terrorist shows a lack of understanding of Irish history. When you look at the changes that occured in Ireland over the 20th century, I would say that Bobby Sands would be as important a figure as Pearse and Connelly were in 1916

I agree with that mate but would trace the politicisation of Republican violence back to Kieran Nugent refusing to "wear no convict's uniform".

I hope someday to write about it.

[merle haggard]

sadly you probably will , ignorant of the fact Billy McKee and others had fought criminilisation years previously . Are you saying the republican struggle was apolitical pre 1976 ?

[Armchair Activist]

Once a bully always a bully Kev and either way BS is burning in hell no doubt and has definetely rotted away in the ground. With a bit of luck he died in as much pain as the people whose deaths he was responsible for.

NOT ORGINAL COMMENT!!!!

An emotional response to an un-liked minded person relating to his opinion over Bobby Sands. usage of fowl and insulting language caused be to alter the initial comment

[bobbysands81]

sadly you probably will

What's your problem?

[Cara]

And another one crawls out of the woodwork.

Beginning to think I'm in the twilight zone...where have all the newbies suddenly appeared from?

Back to the discussion...Bobby Sands, a man who showed great honour and courage, and his enemies still fear his memory. 26 years ago I stood beside his coffin draped in the tricolour, its difficult to know what he would have made of events today, but a good man was lost along with many others, and theres no doubt they changed the history of this country and for that will never be forgotten, RIP.

[tralee bay]

What a load of bollox - Bobby Sands was a terrorist. If he had had any brains he would be no different to the Muslims nutters of today who think there is nothing wrong with a bomb going off and killing woman and children and innocent men and people in a shopping market just as he would have thought nothing about killing a UK soildier doing their job and in the end the likes of Sands achieved nothing and it was only when Sinn Fein realised it could never win a terror war that it gave up and started to talk. Sure it could bomb the UK and kill people but that would never lead to the British leaving. It just prolonged Ulster being a poor ************************hole the British didn't want and the southern Irish didn't want and probably still don't if they are honest.

Bobby Sands is no Nelson Mandela.

Can This Fine Gael Member stoop any lower :

[merle haggard]

sadly you probably will

What's your problem?

your claiming the armed struggle was apolitical pre 1976

[bobbysands81]

[quote=merle haggard]

sadly you probably will

What's your problem?

your claiming the armed struggle was apolitical pre 1976[/quote:qzxycrh8]

No I'm not.

What I am saying is that I believe a direct line can be traced back from today's Peace Process to Kieran Nugent refusing to wear the criminals uniform.

Whilst researching my first thesis I realised the importance of Nugent's stand to what culminated in the Peace Process. As I keep an open mind when I get into writing about things my hypothesis might prove to be wrong.

Thank you for the words of encouragement.

[merle haggard]

I suggest then as an essential part of your research you contact Tony Catney from Belfast, formerly big cheese within sinn fein until very very recently and central player in all the developments , political and military that led up to todays peace process . He outlined the origins of the peace process during a talk in the felons club on the falls during the week .He was the man tasked by the movement to deal directly with governemnt and apply for the very first grants for cultural , womens and political groups in nationalist areas in 1990 .
Not only were the grants approved for the first year but the civil servants told him a second years funding was approved with the first application also. Which when you think of the fact it was 1990 and London was being bombed seems a little strange that the governemnt would be encouraging the bombers with very generous financial aid packags approved 2 years in advance .
Later during further negotiations on more extensive funding a Whitehall official made it very clear to him their intention was to create a nationalist middle class from scratch within the republican areas . And this they did . People became tied to the grants , the jobs , the funding , family life mortgages , aspirations towards even nicer houses , cars areas etc . Local womens groups attending the Felons meeting made the point that on every international womens day they gathered as a seperate republican grouping and marched down the falls to join up with the main womens parade , as republicans who rejected the state . Today they arent permitted to talk about anything controversial or to make any point against the British state or occupation . They are confined to discusiions about health , beauty treatments , dog dirt on the streets . Theyd lose their funding if they spoke their minds . They today complain they were better off without the funding , now theyve sold their souls . Thats their own analysis , not mine .
Todays peace process is hailed as a huge victory because Martin McGuinness and Ian Paisley are jointly begging Gordon Brown for more money and more grants to prop up the British administration in Ireland and sustain the newly created micro bourgeoisie in republican areas . They are tied to the funding . Thats the root and the end measure of the peace process .
Kieran Nugent refused to look for concessions , concessions that were available to him had he gone into the system . His political stance was that the partition of Ireland was a crime , the occupation a crime , his captors criminals and he wasnt going to be a hypocrite and accept criminalisation from a pack of criminals . Although if he had heve been well rewarded with privileges and an easy life . He chose hardship instead . That political stance cannot be squared with the acceptance of all he fought against , Ulsterisation Normalisation and criminalisation . Acceptance of the crime as legitimate , the criminals as legitmate and lawful and donning PSNI uniforms , much much worse than prison uniforms . Kieran Nugent died of poverty , neglect and alcoholism , suffering terribly from the mental demons brought about by his torture and refusal to submit at the hands of immoral degenerate criminals . superfluous to the needs of the peace process in a state were the criminals rule and legitimacy is unquestioned by our political leaders today ..
I apologise for my arrogant remark earlier but its a subject im quite tetchy on for personal reasons . The revisionism emanating from within the propaganda machine of sinn fein has a lot of people thoroughly confused on the subject . Thankfully as the felons meeting showed more and more are seeing the issues in a much more cleaer light .