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  1. #81
    Venceremos Venceremos is offline

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    Not a great fan of either profession, but I hate generalizations more. Here are some examples:

    Mary Robinson (lawyer and teacher)

    Robert Kennedy (Lawyer)

    Mahatma Gandhi (Lawyer)

    Abraham Lincoln (Lawyer)

    Barak Obama (Lawyer)

    Cicero (lawyer)

    (sorry for the US bias - that's Google for you!)
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  2. #82
    Fractional Reserve Fractional Reserve is offline

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    You will get good leaders ,when you stop banks controlling givernments , and allowing them to purchase votes for cash ,through running mad deficits and kicking the debt down the road to screw future generations. It doesn't matter which profession they come from ,as long as they are , thinkers and pragmatic .
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  3. #83
    NewGoldDream NewGoldDream is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by Venceremos View Post
    Not a great fan of either profession, but I hate generalizations more. Here are some examples:

    Mary Robinson (lawyer and teacher)

    Robert Kennedy (Lawyer)

    Mahatma Gandhi (Lawyer)

    Abraham Lincoln (Lawyer)

    Barak Obama (Lawyer)

    Cicero (lawyer)

    (sorry for the US bias - that's Google for you!)
    Padraig Pearse

    Wolfe Tone

    Robert Emmett
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  4. #84
    Raketemensch Raketemensch is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bigblackhorse View Post
    lawyers are trained to look back so they can never be good leaders - leaders need a vision for the future not a view of the past
    Great point, tried to 'like'.
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  5. #85
    johnfás johnfás is offline

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    Quote Originally Posted by Raketemensch View Post
    Great point, tried to 'like'.
    Perhaps, if it were accurate, but of course it is not. A lawyer's training is to analyse a problem and manufacture a solution, whether that is a defence for their client in litigation, or whether that is how to overcome an obstacle within the law, i.e. advising on a restructuring programme. I've always been slightly perplexed by the hatred of lawyers around here. I mean, apart from conveyancing you are quite entitled to carry out all your legal work by yourself. Assuming it is so simple and straightforward why not do so?
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  6. #86
    Raketemensch Raketemensch is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by johnfás View Post
    Perhaps, if it were accurate, but of course it is not. A lawyer's training is to analyse a problem and manufacture a solution, whether that is a defence for their client in litigation, or whether that is how to overcome an obstacle within the law, i.e. advising on a restructuring programme. I've always been slightly perplexed by the hatred of lawyers around here. I mean, apart from conveyancing you are quite entitled to carry out all your legal work by yourself. Assuming it is so simple and straightforward why not do so?
    Hatred is not the point. Lawyering is a job focussed on interpreting current conditions to favour the client's situation. There's not much visioning or strategy involved beyond growing the business. Politicians should be able to envision a different world based on more than current legislation and business rules.

    Nobody has any problem with lawyers becoming politicians, we are just questioning why it almost seems to be a pre-requisite when the overlap is superficial at best.
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  7. #87
    Alfie's Sock Alfie's Sock is offline

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    Quote Originally Posted by NewGoldDream View Post
    Padraig Pearse

    Wolfe Tone

    Robert Emmett
    Not too sure that these were politicians?
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  8. #88
    corelli corelli is offline
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    Jack Lynch was a Barrister, as was Liam Cosgrave. Lynch played a stormer, to his credit, during the Arms Trial and Cosgrave was more in an Enda Kenny form of leader, in that he tried to have talented people around him and was more chairman than leader. Given the records of our last two Taoiseagh, they would both be considered successful leaders.

    I would say, though, that Cosgrave crossing the dail to vote against, and defeat, his own Government over a contraception bill, after the Supreme Court had recently declared banning married couples from obtaining contraceptives was unconstitutional, was an extraordinary example of putting personal considerations, (he was a right wing Catholic) over the interests of the Country.
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  9. #89
    Berchmans Berchmans is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by jmcc View Post
    And that's where the knowledge versus opinion problem starts. In the Humanities, beyond the original works, there is really just opinion. And the teachers are thus largely teaching opinion. The Sciences operate on the basis of hypothesis and proof.

    Is what is being taught knowledge or opinion and is there any clear differentiation?

    What makes one teacher's or writer's or critic's opinion worth more than that of others to the extent that it is taught as part of a course - popularity? There's the danger that the most popular opinions may form the basis for a course. And it is that herd mentality of following the most popular ideas that has produced such wonderful politicians as Biffo (lawyer), Lenihan (lawyer), Dempsey (teacher), Harney (teacher) etc.

    Regards...jmcc
    And so you still won't answer my question.

    I give up.
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