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Thread: Ireland is not a Democracy. Change is therefore impossible.

  1. #141
    Politics.ie Regular darkhorse's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LeDroit View Post
    Got to thinking about our 'system' today. I was considering how it could be reformed or reinvented when it suddenly hit me that Ireland is not actually a democracy.

    The Presidency;
    A citizen is not entitled to run for the presidency. You cannot get your name on the ballot paper unless a political party nominates you. Therefore the electorate only get a choice of what the establishment gives them. Thus, since the nomination process is rigged that's not a free and fair election. The People do not pick their President, the establishment does.

    The Seanad;
    Shooting fish in a barrel this one. The people do not get a vote. Only certain citizens are deemed worthy of voting, eg university graduates. Most senators are 'elected' by fellow politicians, eg councillors, and for some they don't even bother with the charade and the Taioseach just appoints them. So the Seanad is completely outside the control of the citizen. The establishment decides again.

    The Taoiseach;
    Is not elected by the people at all. Fellow TDs 'elect' him. The people have no choice on who their leader is. They just get to pick a guy who gets to choose on 'their' behalf. The only problem is that the TD can only become a TD with the gift of the establishment (see below), therefore the establishment decides who the Taoiseach is.

    The Dail/TDs;
    The only kind of democratic bit on the face of it. Theoretically any citizen can run for election to the Dail but in practice it costs money. If you are not already a TD or a selected candidate by an existing political party then you can't get state funding to finance that campaign. And you are not allowed to fundraise from within your own means or from within a small group of supporters as the establishment have set the rules so that there is an individual limit on the donation per person. Thus, new individuals or new parties cannot enter the fray. The establishment decides who is on the ballot paper with any realistic financial wherewithal to actually get elected. Certainly, it's so restrictive that a sufficiently large group of new candidates cannot be elected to challenge the establishments status quo. In addition, even if you do get elected you are not allowed to speak in the Dail unless the establishment affords you 'speaking rights'.

    So, the Establishment decides who is a TD, Senator, President and Taoiseach. The People do not. We do not have a Democracy. Change is impossible.
    Actually, the problem is the reverse - Ireland has too much democracy - compliments of our PR system. With our version of PR every shade of opinion is (or theoritically should be) be represented according to their number in the Dail. Which adds up to indecision and imposibility of change - every view and very opinion is represented among the already large number of deputies per head of population.
    If we had adopted the British first-past-the-post system combined with a lesser number of deputies per head of population, we could be sure that the balance of common sense would prevail among the electorate.
    Although perhaps 10% of every electorate may be loonies they dont get a say in Government in a first past the post system such as they have in the UK.

  2. #142
    Politics.ie Regular EUrJokingMeRight's Avatar
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    People just want freedom and money. Let them have the opportunity to access it. Let them be able to work for the opportunity.
    The government takes away their freedom and taxes their sweat, The government takes their money via tax and wastes it on mercs, quangos and jets. The government borrows 'future' money, for hospitals and schools, and gives it to banks. The banks also directly take the peoples money and and also their sweat, via interest.

    So what is in it for the people? That means 'YOU' stupid. Well not a lot really.
    Arguing about the type of country, democracy or republic, is a moot point.

    If people, that means 'YOU', keep absorbing 'ALL of the pain' from the government, that really the government and the banks and the markets should also be taking, then the people, that means 'YOU', only have themselves to blame.

    But Ireland is not a democracy in the true sense. PR is a scam. Vote transfer is a scam.
    'Regulators' are Just keeping a lookout whilst the theft/scam continues unobstructed.

    Our political system is an affront to decency.

    The people, that means 'YOU', never get anything from politicians and they know they will never get anything from any new party or any 'revolution'.
    We are a 'Resig'nation.

    The future of the country depends not on lenihan or cowen, or enda, or laboured or mary lou, but on the people, that means 'YOU', themselves.

    If the people, that means 'YOU', do not take responsibility for the future of their country and the future of their children and grandchildren then somebody else will.

    And you can bet that 'somebody else' does not have the best interests of the people, that means 'YOU', at heart.

    The only interest they're interested in is what interest the political system, including the current government, are giving them via taxing you more.

    Making you work longer, harder, faster and with less rights for less and less money, less freedoms, less services, less thanks and less of a future for you, your children and your grandchildren.

    It is down to 'You'. Each and every one of 'You'. Stop waiting on the other guy, He's already corrupt.

    (and to think I just got up to have a horlicks! Damn you ledroit!!!! )
    Last edited by EUrJokingMeRight; 3rd October 2010 at 01:04 AM. Reason: :D
    Fianna Fail - The Anti Democratic Party & The Anti Constitutional Party. Traitors of Irishmen and Irishwomen.

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