Does the Southern people care what happened to the Northern Nationalists?

[markeys]

Glennshane, You're a peach! You often lighten up threads here with your peculiar Catholic enclave type views but in any case:

By "loyalist" do you mean Prod? If so, please say so. We Catholics are loyalists too but we are loyal to different things.

WHat difference does religion make to who is being murdered? Its still murder.

QUOTE=Glennshane;1968576]
"The IRA were as bad as the UVF, the INLA as bad as the UFF"

I strongly resent that statement. It was the UVF who started the violence.
The killing of people because of their religion or perceived religion was a Prod speciality. The deliberate no-warning car bombing of places frequented by civilians was a Prod speciality.
[/QUOTE]
The IRA also did these things. There sectarianism was only wrapped in a green flag, the UVF's in a UK flag. Makes no difference to the end result - they were all murdering scumbags equally worthy of contempt.
Don't be deluded into thinking the IRA had anything to do with 'catholics'. They killed a fair number of them when it suited their murder campaign, didn't they?

"Wonder how a party can claim to be about equality when they have never treated Irish people as equal?"

Do you treat the Catholic people of Northern Ireland as equals?

Yes. Care to point out somewhere where I've ever done otherwise?#

"Wanted self determination, and yet refused to listen when the Irish people decided."

Why should the Ulster Catholic freedom fighters listen to the people of Eire, the tribe which abandoned us in 1921?

What are teh Ulster Catholic Freedom Figters? If you'd care to elaborate perhaps? I was talking about the the IRA who claimed to be acting in the Irish People's name, and proclaimed themselves Governmental authority of the Repubic. Given such grandstanding claims, you'd think they'd obey what Irish people were saying - they didn't, therefore denied them the right to self-determination and in the process abused Irish people's human rights and waged a terror campaign on Irish people.

"We'd have achieved unification by now without their murder gangs roaming about the joint."

Can you prove that? Where is your evidence?

I think its a fair statement. The border is more entrenched than ever now, thanks directly to IRA murder gangs ensuring that both sides of the community are more divided than ever.

P.S. I resent your describing the killing of my oppressors as "murder". Leave judgement on that to the victims of tyranny.

#
It was murder. Unlawful killing is murder. Jus because you decide you have some sort of 'superiority' over others to decide who can and cannot be put to death doesn't make it any less so. Are you from the UVF? The case you make for killing sounds an awful lot like their line of thought? Maybe UFF? They too claim rights in deciding who to murder. Sorry, kill of course.

[Border-Rat]

The IRA were as bad as the UVF

Care to provide examples of IRA decapitation, skinning alive and castration?

[Glennshane]

[QUOTE=markeys;1968603]

"WHat difference does religion make to who is being murdered?"

Catholics were often murdered simply because of their religion. Prods rarely so. That may not matter to you. It does matter to me. And it is very relevant to your allegation that the IRA were as sectarian as the UVF. I wish that they had been.

"Makes no difference to the end result - they were all murdering scumbags equally worthy of contempt."

It makes a difference to me. Those who risked their lives to defend the Short Strand were not scumbags. They were Catholic defenders.

"Don't be deluded into thinking the IRA had anything to do with 'catholics'."

The IRA never hurt me. The Prods did.

"Yes. Care to point out somewhere where I've ever done otherwise?"

You have preached about the right of self-determination of the people of Ireland and have failed to assert that same right for the Catholic people of Northern Ireland.

"I was talking about the the IRA who claimed to be acting in the Irish People's name"

Only when they were waging their "Brits out" campaign. When defending the Short Strand or carrying out reprisals for attacks on Catholics, they did not claim to be acting in the name of the Eire people.

"and proclaimed themselves Governmental authority of the Repubic. Given such grandstanding claims, you'd think they'd obey what Irish people were saying - they didn't, therefore denied them the right to self-determination and in the process abused Irish people's human rights and waged a terror campaign on Irish people."

I think that the politcs of Eire should be left to the people of Eire and that the oppressed Catholic people of Northern Ireland should be left to deal with our oppressors as we see fit.

"The border is more entrenched than ever now,"

Cheers.

"thanks directly to IRA murder gangs ensuring that both sides of the community are more divided than ever."

I disagree. The Prods were misbehaving before the IRA went to war.

"It was murder."

You might see the killing of my enemies as "murder". I do not.

[markeys]

Care to provide examples of IRA decapitation, skinning alive and castration?

Oh I see. There's a difference between blowing a kid to smithereens, shooting a mother in the back of the head and slashing somebody's throat?

Silly me! I thought they were all murder! I'm also sure that decapitation was a regular occurance of IRA bombings, as was 'skinning' and castration.

Well done however. You've just shown the empty numbskull attitude to murder.

IRA = UVF = UFF = murder gangs = sectarianism = division = unification further away then ever. Well done the IRA for ensuring unification remains a distant goal.

[essexboy]

No, they don't give a xxxx about Northern Ireland or the people who live there.
Sad but true.

[HEAVENHELPUS]

No, they don't give a xxxx about Northern Ireland or the people who live there.
Sad but true.

I'd say you're right.

[Border-Rat]

Oh I see. There's a difference between blowing a kid to smithereens, shooting a mother in the back of the head and slashing somebody's throat?

So that would be a no, then? Thought so.

[markeys]

So that would be a no, then? Thought so.

Good whataboutery again. The UVF slashed throats, the IRA blew mothers heads off. Bombed plenty of kids to bits. Only an IRA / UVF supporter could actually attempt to distinguish between whether one form of murder was better than the other. Tell me, how do you score between the two? The amount of pain inflicted? The grief of the loved ones? Interesting point, but probably one you'd feel more at home with discussing with those that actually carried out the murders or their sick supporters. They'd probably relish in debating whether is was more appropriate to murder by beating someone to death or slashing their throats.

The relevant point remains the same. The IRA were in the same league as the UVF. Both were hated. Both murdered and maimed in an attempt to gain power over the people. Which flag they decided to wrap themsevles in to gain some shred of legitimacy is irrelevant to the Irish people, just as is your point about the 'rightness' of the murder method.

[Anamnua]

If I never voted again I wouldn't vote SDLP. They do nothing for the people of my area.

Warts and all, they are the only nationalist party without blood on their hands. If you don't like their general orientation then you and others like you should join up and turn things around.

[st333ve]

The people in the north do not bear the shame of the troubles or what happened back then.

There isnt 'two sides'.
There are many sides with many opinions.

The majority of people here resisted conflict and it is those who resist conflict who will provail.

Those who support it are doomed to hate, those who resist it and speak against it will further their cause as the majority of people will identify with them.