MI5 behind Northern Bank robbery

[Skin]

In light of recent revelations and with regard to further allegations that two more, possibly three more senior Sinn Fein officials are actually British spies is it not concievable therefore that the Northern Bank Raid was carried out by these spies working for British intelligence?
Is it not concieveable, considering the timing of that robbery, that this was to be the IRA's 'sackcloth and ashes'?
It is worth noting that when paisley made that speech that Bill Lowry, head of the PSNI operation that raided Sinn Fein offices in Stormont, was on the same platform with Paisley.
I remain convinced more than ever now that British spies were completely behind the Castlereagh break-in, the Stormont spy ring and the Northern Bank robbery. They are in effect a criminal organisation and the British Government should do the decent thing and withdraw from all the political and security affairs of Ireland.

[Bogwarrior]

Or more plausible, British spies were behing PSF's peace strategy, and dismantling of PIRA. Donaldson was a staunch ally of Adams, and shared his politics, as did Scap. Are you too blind to see, that PSF's entire strategy, was most likely formulated by using spies and agents, to promote Adams , whilst purging those in the way.
MI5 /MI6 is a hugely powerful organisation, do you really believe they would tolerate rogue agents(securocrats ) working against the British agenda. Their feet wouldn't touch the ground. Look what happened others, who went against Blairs policies, like David Kelly, pre Iraq, or David Shayler.
MI5's strategy(normalisation and Ulsterisation) is almost identical to PSF.

[Libero]

I remain convinced more than ever now that British spies were completely behind the Castlereagh break-in, the Stormont spy ring and the Northern Bank robbery.

Yeah, but if the Brits did it, don't you think they'd do the obvious thing and set up a "find" of loads of cash in some well-known republican's back garden?

As Shinners never tire of reminding us though, there has been very little to solidly link the bank raid to provisional republicans.

If the Brits had done it for the reasons you give, you can be sure there would be.

[stringjack]

It is worth noting that when paisley made that speech that Bill Lowry, head of the PSNI operation that raided Sinn Fein offices in Stormont, was on the same platform with Paisley.
I remain convinced more than ever now that British spies were completely behind the Castlereagh break-in, the Stormont spy ring and the Northern Bank robbery. They are in effect a criminal organisation and the British Government should do the decent thing and withdraw from all the political and security affairs of Ireland.

Hysterical innuendo, pollyanna-like professions of faith and a neat little non sequitur. Just three sentences. Kudos.

[Skin]

Or more plausible, British spies were behing PSF's peace strategy, and dismantling of PIRA. Donaldson was a staunch ally of Adams, and shared his politics, as did Scap. Are you too blind to see, that PSF's entire strategy, was most likely formulated by using spies and agents, to promote Adams , whilst purging those in the way.
MI5 /MI6 is a hugely powerful organisation, do you really believe they would tolerate rogue agents(securocrats ) working against the British agenda. Their feet wouldn't touch the ground. Look what happened others, who went against Blairs policies, like David Kelly, pre Iraq, or David Shayler.
MI5's strategy(normalisation and Ulsterisation) is almost identical to PSF.

As per usual it is nearly impossible to get a straight answer from anyone on this site. I never said nor denied that British spies were involved at some level in SF peace strategy but that apparently doesn't stop you going off on your own tangent. But to answer your questions, I have no doubt that British agents were involved at some level behind SF peace strategy. Simple logic would deduce that Adams and co had favoured this position as far back as 1986 (even earlier), therefore it made sense from a British point of view to protect and promote this viewpoint seeing as it was coming from those who held the most influence within the republican movement. The position has been for a number of years that Adams and co while promoting a peaceful settlement had still not settled the question of the IRA. By commiting crimes such as the Stormont spy-ring, the Castlereagh break-in and the Northern Bank robbery and associating them with the IRA it was hoped it would force the issue on Adams and co as to whether they could make the break from the IRA or not. Ultimately it was the murder of Robert McCartney, (a crime committed by the IRA) that pushed this issue and led to Adams calling on the IRA to end their campaign and fully embrace the political project and not Stormont, Castlereagh or NB (crimes committed by British intelligience).
Yes I do believe MI5 would tolerate rougue agents. Check out the Littlejohn brothers affair in the 70's these were MI5 agents who committed bankrobberies in the Republic in an attempt to disgrace the IRA. Also see Dublin/Monaghan bombings, shoot-to-kill, collusion etc etc, - anyone with a cursory knowledge of Northern Ireland will know that rogue British agents (by this I mean people who act outside the law committing murders, bank robberies and other crimes - completey distinct from intelligience gathering operations) have been operating in Ireland for decades. How would you define a rogue agent?
So maybe you can now answer my first question. Is it not concievable, in light of recent revelations, allegations and past activities of British security that British spies were behind the Northern Bank robbery? You fail to answer this.

[Skin]

I remain convinced more than ever now that British spies were completely behind the Castlereagh break-in, the Stormont spy ring and the Northern Bank robbery.

Yeah, but if the Brits did it, don't you think they'd do the obvious thing and set up a "find" of loads of cash in some well-known republican's back garden?

As Shinners never tire of reminding us though, there has been very little to solidly link the bank raid to provisional republicans.

If the Brits had done it for the reasons you give, you can be sure there would be.

You really are naive at the best of times. The crimes committed by rogue British agents were designed to scupper Sinn Feins entry to government. If they can pin the crimes on someone that would be a bonus but as the stormont affair proves that can be a messy business. The fact is in the public mind at large the IRA committed the NB robbery and Adams and co authorised it. Job done!

[Bogwarrior]

Skin, do you have any plausible reason, as to WHY British agents would not want PSF entering Stormont, and accepting and administering British Rule in Ireland?

[Badboy]

If you take this to its logical conclusion perhaps the entire armed struggle was a plot by the British to discredit Irish Republicanism. Maybe all of Sinn Fein and the IRA are in fact British agents.

One thing is clear - those of us who don't swallow the provo vision of Irishness hook line and sinker have a right to be a bit pieved at being called West Brits by people whose party was(/is?) ran by MI5/MI6 agents.

[Skin]

Skin, do you have any plausible reason, as to WHY British agents would not want PSF entering Stormont, and accepting and administering British Rule in Ireland?

Again I have to settle to answer your questions but you still refuse to answer mine.
The reason why some British agents, namely those in the NIO, do not want Sinn Fein in power is because of their association with the IRA. While this is a legitimate concern it does not give them the right to commit crimes. I cannot understand how people who stand on the high moral ground and condemn the IRA cannot bring themselves to admit that elements of British intelligience have, for as long as the anyone can remember, been involved in serious crimes such as murder, bank robbing, blackmail, and bribery all apparently in the name of justice.

Again I ask you, do you have an answer to my first question?

[coconut]

People will condemn the IRA beforehand because said people are naive enough to believe that a "democratically-elected government" has the right to commit atrocities in order to crush "terrorism" while paramilitaries and guerrillas do not, even if it is for a noble cause.