They call this justice?

[SevenStars]

Tiocfaidh four people were interned in the Free State from Derry after crossing the border and the main piece of evidence was that they had a collection of the writings of Bobby Sands in the car....On that basis my council flat is terrorist central (which it isnt).

[tiocfaidh]

Tiocfaidh four people were interned in the Free State from Derry after crossing the border and the main piece of evidence was that they had a collection of the writings of Bobby Sands in the car....On that basis my council flat is terrorist central (which it isnt).

Disgraceful. But sadly I am not too surprised. I hope their internment was short-lived.

[Sync]

I can see how if they can prove the conspiracy part based upon other evidence, then they should all be convicted of conspiracy, but if it's as simple as they found a gun and the 4 men are known republicans, then its wrong.

You've no idea if there's other evidence. You don't know what the men said under questioning. You don't know what the 2 released men said under questioning.

Is there no onus on the prosecution to actually prove who had the gun?

They haven't proven anything yet. I think you're overly hung up on who's pocket the gun was in, you're making a legitimate defence's argument, but in front of a jury that can't be "My client didn't have the gun, you can't prove he did", it needs to be "My client didn't have the gun, it was Man X, my client had no idea of any crime"

If you get pulled over and the police find a half ounce of weed in a car with 4 people in it, I don't think they are all charged.

Yes, they could be. See any one who's ever been arrested on the seas shipping in cocaine. Joint venture. You can't have a case of the 4 just throwing a gun around amongst them and the unfortunate it lands on goes to prison while his 3 accomplices walk free.

Or if they do they cannot all be convicted. Should there not be additional evidence required that actually shows that someone in particular had the gun? This is the whole point of a democratic system - more evidence than simply being in the vicinity of a crime should be needed to convict someone of involvement with that crime.

I'm not sure you're using the word "Democratic" correctly. If the 4 refuse to cooperate with police questioning then that can be used against them in court.

Going back to the four today, it certainly seems possible to me that one or more of the 4 might not have known that the gun was in the car. It is certainly within the realm of possibility. And a real democracy would acknowledge that. The burden of proving guilt must lie with the prosecution.

It is possible that people were unaware (most probably the 2 already released without charge). If they were unaware then you fully and truthfully tell what he does know to the police to aid them in the prosecution of their dangerous acquaintance.

I would like to hear PSF's thoughts on this law.

I don't want to put words in their mouths, but I'm pretty sure they'll say that the police should try to take illegal weapons off the streets and citizens should cooperate to that effect.

The short answer to your question though is yes, it's quite possible in either Ireland or England to be convicted of this crime even if the gun wasn't in your pocket.

[Sync]

Apparently that is all that's needed to be charged with firearms possession in the 6C.

You see to an impartial reader it isn't apparent at all. If it was, why not charge all 6 in the car? Don't you think there may be more evidence here than you're aware of and that you're assuming a lot simply by the fact that people are being charged?

[SevenStars]

Disgraceful. But sadly I am not too surprised. I hope their internment was short-lived.

Derry 4 freed after trial collapses - Sunday Journal

But still...

[SevenStars]

You see to an impartial reader it isn't apparent at all. If it was, why not charge all 6 in the car? Don't you think there may be more evidence here than you're aware of and that you're assuming a lot simply by the fact that people are being charged?

I in no way approve of hard drugs but I have been in cars where they were present.

[British Citizen]

I in no way approve of hard drugs but I have been in cars where they were present.

Somewhat typical of anti-agreement Republicans these days isn't it?

[picador]

This is exactly how Bobby Sandy, Joe McDonnell and two others were arrested in 1976. All four received 14 year sentences.

Don't recall hearing anything about a bombing or a gun battle last night.

[Sync]

I in no way approve of hard drugs but I have been in cars where they were present.

And if you got pulled over in a car carrying enough drugs for distribution, and refused to answer questions, you'd more than likely get charged. What's hard to understand about that?

[picador]

How do you know it's obvious to all 4 of them, and that all 4 consented? How do you not know, for example, that the driver had it under his seat and the other three were unaware?

How do you know that it wasn't obvious? Why are you saying that the driver is guilty?

Six men were arrested initially. Two haven't been charged.