Is John Waters mad?

[code twinkle]

Waters, in today's IT, writing about the Monageer killings, blames the incident on "a culture of denial" in Irish society. This, he writes, meant that nothing was done after the Dunne children's father told the undertaker that he was planning the family's funeral "not because of a lack of information or resources"..."but because the system assumed...that the Dunne children would be safe because their mother was freely involved in their affairs". He goes on to say that this indicates "a sick society...we deny human nature, regarding mothers as reincarnations of the Blessed Virgin Mary and father as sons of Satan".

Essentially the man's very stupid point is that the Dunne children died because we all think mother's usually have their children's best interests at heart whereas men are more likely to pose a danger to children.

Hello? How remedial is this example? Has it somehow escaped Water's biased consciousness that the Dunne children and their mother were indeed murdered by their father.

This man's twisted, tendentious logic defies belief. HOW has he still got a column in the Irish Times?

Blind spot at heart of family tragedy - The Irish Times - Fri, May 15, 2009

[draiocht23]

I long ago came to the conclusion that he's a complete loon.

[goosebump]

HOW has he still got a column in the Irish Times?

Because people like you keep refering others to his articles.

[code twinkle]

Because people like you keep refering others to his articles.

Touché. I honestly very very rarely read his articles because he tends to generate this reaction in me, but I am interested in the Monageer case and against my better judgement read it. I do think there are genuine editorial issues around printing this piece - not just is it incredibly bad comment, but there is also the subtle implication that Ciara Dunne was responsible for the deaths of her children when in fact the Monageer report made clear the killings were "driven" by the father, and also that Ciara had a particularly childlike nature that absolved her further from responsibility.

[Clanrickard]

Touché. I honestly very very rarely read his articles because he tends to generate this reaction in me, but I am interested in the Monageer case and against my better judgement read it. I do think there are genuine editorial issues around printing this piece - not just is it incredibly bad comment, but there is also the subtle implication that Ciara Dunne was responsible for the deaths of her children when in fact the Monageer report made clear the killings were "driven" by the father, and also that Ciara had a particularly childlike nature that absolved her further from responsibility.

That is not what he said. He said people assumed that with a mother there the children were ok. Had it been a father who said what she said or a single father action would have been taken. On fatherhood Waters is on the money. Fatherhood is not taken seriously in Ireland and the deck is stacked against men in the event of divorce or separation. Also there is this idea that men are intrinsically more violent towards kids when the opposite is the case. It has got to the point where people have said to me they wouldn't trust a play school with a male teacher.

[code twinkle]

That is not what he said. He said people assumed that with a mother there the children were ok. Had it been a father who said what she said or a single father action would have been taken. On fatherhood Waters is on the money. Fatherhood is not taken seriously in Ireland and the deck is stacked against men in the event of divorce or separation. Also there is this idea that men are intrinsically more violent towards kids when the opposite is the case. It has got to the point where people have said to me they wouldn't trust a play school with a male teacher.

The father killed his children in this case. If you want to make a point about stats on violence towards kids, you do it, you certainly don't twist and torture logic to attempt to use this example. This piece would get an F in a basic essay-writing class.

[cactusflower]

If John Waters posted here he would be considered a single-topic troll.

[TradCat]

I think you missed the point by some distance. He was not blaming Ciara Dunne. Read it again.

Secondly if we are going to discuss these cases at all then we should do it without any pieties. If Waters is wrong then argue the point but to suggest he is mad is a bit pathetic really.

[manicstreetporter]

Yes, he is.

[joel]

Waters, in today's IT, writing about the Monageer killings, blames the incident on "a culture of denial" in Irish society. This, he writes, meant that nothing was done after the Dunne children's father told the undertaker that he was planning the family's funeral "not because of a lack of information or resources"..."but because the system assumed...that the Dunne children would be safe because their mother was freely involved in their affairs". He goes on to say that this indicates "a sick society...we deny human nature, regarding mothers as reincarnations of the Blessed Virgin Mary and father as sons of Satan".

Essentially the man's very stupid point is that the Dunne children died because we all think mother's usually have their children's best interests at heart whereas men are more likely to pose a danger to children.

Hello? How remedial is this example? Has it somehow escaped Water's biased consciousness that the Dunne children and their mother were indeed murdered by their father.

This man's twisted, tendentious logic defies belief. HOW has he still got a column in the Irish Times?

Blind spot at heart of family tragedy - The Irish Times - Fri, May 15, 2009

To be fair, he is like the majority of Irish columnists - he blames most things on the Original Sin of being Irish. A self-hater and an Irish hater. People like that should stop continually bringing the Irish people down.