Sarah Carey takes a swipe at The Sunday Times over Lisbon

[blacbloc]

Both the Irish Times and the Sunday Times have a clear editorial agenda when it comes to the Treaty of Lisbon.

However, the comments on the actions of both newspapers stink of hypocrisy.

The Irish Times has taken an editorial line which it believes to be in the best interests of Ireland and has been condemend for this.

It's also published anti-Lisbon commentary by nationally known commentators, clear evidence of an attempt (even if inadequate) to facilitate a balanced debate.

The Sunday Times has taken an editorial line which is in the best interests of Rupert Murdoch and has been supported for this.

It's refused to publish pro-Lisbon commentary, clear evidence of an attempt to stifle a balanced debate.

The clear bias of the Irish Times leading up to the referendum is evident from the quotations below. But the argument above is ludicrous. By virture of being a yes supporter, one is automatically motivated by genuine concern and patriotic duty - while no voters must be thought to have no concerns of those kinds. It's the usual condescencion of the 'yes' elite. By this insulting logic we are to understand that it is only natural that The Irish Times should so clearly bias its coverage to a particular view. Here's some information to put it in context:

The following are the headlines of all the articles discussing the treaty from the Irish Times opinion page in the 5 days leading up to the referendum:


The imperative is a Yes vote

Voters are well enough informed to make decision [by Mr Justice Iarfhlaith O'Neill is chairman of the Referendum Commission]

Indefensible 'defence' dimension demands a No vote

Yes vote required to prevent Ireland's isolation and a loss of jobs

If you care about climate change, vote Yes to Lisbon

A question of influence ["After seven years of hard bargaining this Lisbon compromise would be very difficult to renegotiate after a No vote"]

In absence of trust, coherence is all the more crucial ["A reasonable set of answers to some questions would have seen the treaty Yes campaign coast home"]

Europe deserves a better treaty than this [Jens-Peter Bonde from Denmark is a long-time critic of the European project]

A No vote will damage the EU and also hurt us economically

Vote No for Fear. Vote Yes for Hope. The choice is ours

No vote would precipitate a major European crisis

No better deal if we reject treaty

Are we out of our minds? ["ARE WE out of our collective minds? We are not going to win our money on "the horses" if we say No to the Lisbon Treaty."]

As a nation we have simply too much to lose by voting No to the Lisbon Treaty

Support for No vote shows lack of faith in politicians

Gulf between leaders, voters frames treaty ["the increased muscle a Yes vote would give the Government within the EU system"]

Voting No would plunge us into uncertainty and crisis


Of the 17 articles, 14 could accurately be described as 'Yes', 2 as 'No' and 1 neither 'Yes' or 'No'. Of the 14 'Yes' articles, a substantial proportion of the authors portray a 'No' vote as being potentially catastrophic, using terms such as 'crisis' and 'much to lose' – it can be seen that as the day of the referendum approaches the headlines and articles become noticeably more desperate.

All the above was volubly echoed at the other Lord Sauron's newspaper 'The Independent'

The following are the headlines of all the articles discussing the treaty from the Irish Independent opinion and analysis page in the 5 days leading up to the referendum:

Damn, no secular takeover after all ["So, despite the fact that there'll be no legalisation of drugs, prostitution, abortion or euthanasia, and no conscription into a European Army or relinquishing of our tax laws, I'll still be voting "yes" next Thursday. Boring, but true. The Devil would not approve."

Damn, no secular takeover after all - Analysis - Independent.ie

We need to think of consequences ["The notion that the people of Europe would applaud an Irish rejection of the Lisbon Treaty is dangerous nonsense and it is revealed as a lie by reports of widespread concern in the EU at the news that the rejection lobby appears to hold the lead."]

We need to think of consequences - Editorial - Independent.ie

Defeat from the jaws of victory ["Yes is the only answer to Thursday's question"]

Defeat from the jaws of victory - Editorial - Independent.ie

Chill wind from dole queues ["Those who would reject the Lisbon Treaty and blithely launch our country into a period of further uncertainty and confusion would dismiss such appeals as scaremongering and bullying."]

Chill wind from dole queues - Editorial - Independent.ie

There is nothing to fear in a Yes vote

There is nothing to fear in a Yes vote - Analysis - Independent.ie

A 'Yes' vote is the best way to keep our economy competitive

A 'Yes' vote is the best way to keep our economy competitive - Tom McEnaney - Independent.ie

This is the only way to ensure we have a say in our future ["By voting 'No' we will emphasise the huge issue involved in the constitutional change."]

This is the only way to ensure we have a say in our future - Analysis - Independent.ie

Time we idealistic 'Yes' voters started to feel the love ["Here's me after arguing for a 'Yes' vote in the Lisbon Treaty because, sweet fool that I am, I think it's the right thing to do. Of course I respect those on the 'No' side who, with equal conviction, are arguing for a 'No' vote out of honest motives. But many on the 'No' side are arguing from self-interest. Now I could, couldn't I, gang up with consumers, taxpayers and the like and say, "Start cutting taxes and prices and reforming the public sector, or me and me mates will vote down this treaty." But I don't. Good citizen and republican (or moron, depending on your viewpoint) that I try to be, I base my vote on the interests of the citizens rather than my own gripes."]

Time we idealistic 'Yes' voters started to feel the love - Analysis - Independent.ie

Add your voice to the chorus for Europe and drown out nay-sayers ["Good For Ireland, Good For Europe."]

Add your voice to the chorus for Europe and drown out nay-sayers - Analysis - Independent.ie

A word to the wise from one Abraham Lincoln ["When the Irish go to the polls they will in a real sense be carrying with them the 450 million disenfranchised Europeans who have no vote. As one of those I humbly ask: Say no, not in this form. Say that this document should go back to the discussion table and be re-written. Say the Irish wish to be consulted with a treaty whose text is clear and lucid for all to read."]

A word to the wise from one Abraham Lincoln - Analysis - Independent.ie

Playing Mr Nice Guy won't secure Yes vote, Brian

Sinn Fein at the heart of the anti-Lisbon lunatic menagerie ["The loonies are always with us, of course, but an issue like this causes them to sprout up like exotic blooms in the desert after a rare rainshower."]

Sinn Fein at the heart of the anti-Lisbon lunatic menagerie - Analysis - Independent.ie

Decision will be far-reaching ["The latter choice would present the EU with a crisis. We can only guess how the Union might set about solving that crisis, but we can be sure the consequences would not be good for Ireland. Those who foresee dancing in the streets of Europe after such an outcome are fooling themselves."]

Decision will be far-reaching - Editorial - Independent.ie

Brian baffles foreign media pack with late charm assault ["After Longford came Mullingar and then it was a dash around his home turf in Tullamore. Here the 'Yes' votes were more numerous -- though some locals were still unconvinced. Two women approached by Brian dug their heels in. What had the Europeans ever done for us, they demanded. If Brian had known his Monty Python he could have replied, "the aqueducts, the roads, education, wine, sanitation . . ." Instead, he was on his best behaviour. "If I ask ye nicely will it make a difference?" he enquired."]

Brian baffles foreign media pack with late charm assault - Lisbon Treaty - Independent.ie

Be wary of the unelected and their hidden agenda ["Any citizen contemplating a 'No' vote would want to think long and hard about the damage that would do to our international reputation as a positive, forward-looking European country."]

Be wary of the unelected and their hidden agenda - Analysis - Independent.ie

Bad news is just the job for 'Yes' campaign

Bad news is just the job for 'Yes' campaign - Fionnan Sheahan - Independent.ie

'Yes' camp's empty Eurobabble should be met by a simple 'No'

'Yes' camp's empty Eurobabble should be met by a simple 'No' - Kevin Myers - Independent.ie

Why 'Yes' and 'No' voters are in a class of their own ["but one thing is clear: the establishment is at odds with the population and this tells us more about Ireland today than it does about Europe tomorrow."]

Why 'Yes' and 'No' voters are in a class of their own - David McWilliams - Independent.ie

Of the 18 articles, 14 could accurately be described as 'Yes', 3 as 'No' and 1 neither 'Yes' or 'No'. Of the 14 'Yes' articles, a number of the authors portray a 'No' vote as being potentially catastrophic, using terms such as 'uncertainty and confusion' and 'damage'. Most if not all use openly derogatory term to describe 'No' campaigners, such as 'lunatic menagerie', and thus by extension, potential 'No' voters.

I

[kerrynorth]

Actually, I don't. I build websites. The stuff I do here I do for the fun of knocking heads with people. It's unpaid, sadly.

So you don't contribute to the drafting of reports for the Commission on the Irish media, particularly online?

[ibis]

So you don't contribute to the drafting of reports for the Commission on the Irish media, particularly online?

I run (and wrote) a software-based 'online clippings' service that looks at trends in article numbers picked up by various keyword combinations, and those numbers may be used in reports. I have also used the figures here.

I'm impressed by the number of people who assume that a commercial relationship with any group automatically makes you some kind of mouthpiece for them. If that is the case, I would like rather a large number of clients taken into consideration, from the educational publishing industry to travel agencies.

[hopi watcher]

I run (and wrote) a software-based 'online clippings' service that looks at trends in article numbers picked up by various keyword combinations, and those numbers may be used in reports. I have also used the figures here.

"For the past ten years the government flung money indiscriminately at people who could do without it. SSIA interest, automatic under-6’s child benefit bonus, over-70’s medical cards and inequitable tax allowances for high earners were all handed over as populist election winners. The money was crudely distributed and is being more crudely recouped, but I can’t help feeling it’s a case of easy come; easy go. What Fianna Fail giveth, Fianna Fail taketh away."

Yet you cannot see that Carey has a credibility problem having written the above analysis of the budget.

[ibis]

"For the past ten years the government flung money indiscriminately at people who could do without it. SSIA interest, automatic under-6’s child benefit bonus, over-70’s medical cards and inequitable tax allowances for high earners were all handed over as populist election winners. The money was crudely distributed and is being more crudely recouped, but I can’t help feeling it’s a case of easy come; easy go. What Fianna Fail giveth, Fianna Fail taketh away."

Yet you cannot see that Carey has a credibility problem having written the above analysis of the budget.

Unless she's actually lying in her claim about the Sunday Times editorial policy, her analytical skills are irrelevant. There's no analysis to be done on being told not to write anything pro-Lisbon - its a very simple claim of fact, and as such, it would potentially open the IT to a libel claim if it is untrue.

People are trying to make this about the journalist. As long as she's telling the truth, she's completely irrelevant. If people wish to allege that she's lying, they should get on and do so. Her ability to analyse budgets, or for that matter GAA, is neither here nor there, because this is a straight matter of fact. I can see why so many people are embarrassed by it, of course - so much so that we seem to have moved from ad hominem attacks on the journalist to ad hominem attacks on me too.

[macdarawhitfield]

They're all secretly west-brit types.

Where does the 'secretly' bit come in?

[hopi watcher]

Unless she's actually lying in her claim about the Sunday Times editorial policy, her analytical skills are irrelevant. There's no analysis to be done on being told not to write anything pro-Lisbon - its a very simple claim of fact, and as such, it would potentially open the IT to a libel claim if it is untrue.

People are trying to make this about the journalist. As long as she's telling the truth, she's completely irrelevant. If people wish to allege that she's lying, they should get on and do so. Her ability to analyse budgets, or for that matter GAA, is neither here nor there, because this is a straight matter of fact. I can see why so many people are embarrassed by it, of course - so much so that we seem to have moved from ad hominem attacks on the journalist to ad hominem attacks on me too.

I have no interest whatever in you and you can wriggle all you wish. Credibility is earned and in the case of a journalist, that is the ability to analysis information honestly and present a possible conclusion for readers to consider. Her piece on the budget was off the wall sufficiently to suggest that she not merely got her assessment of the budget wrong by accident but rather was intent on assembling the 'facts' to suit her conclusion. The whistleblowing piece on the ST was so late as to suggest that she is now merely intent on causing a former employer some embarrassment for some reason or other or perhaps it is a clumsy attempt to reposition herself in the eyes of IT readers. I don't know which but it is up to her to explain herself, but I have an awful feeeling that Madam editor is merely balancing her stable of opinion writers and I have no doubt which side Carey will end up on.

[macdarawhitfield]

Honest to GOD. Why do so many women feel the need to take a swipe at ever one when they move on... look at madonna and he soon to be Ex, the one with one leg [Ex off sir P] and now Ms Carey, do they not realise they are looking very childish doing so, they remind me off's a certin hissy fit specialist I know in my family... am embarressment full stop.

The kindest view of your post is that you were a bit tired when you typed it!I know FG are ahead in the polls but you can't afford to 'nause off' 51 % of the voters.

Maybe you've been reading Rupert's Red Tops too long?

[ibis]

I have no interest whatever in you and you can wriggle all you wish. Credibility is earned and in the case of a journalist, that is the ability to analysis information honestly and present a possible conclusion for readers to consider. Her piece on the budget was off the wall sufficiently to suggest that she not merely got her assessment of the budget wrong by accident but rather was intent on assembling the 'facts' to suit her conclusion. The whistleblowing piece on the ST was so late as to suggest that she is now merely intent on causing a former employer some embarrassment for some reason or other or perhaps it is a clumsy attempt to reposition herself in the eyes of IT readers. I don't know which but it is up to her to explain herself, but I have an awful feeeling that Madam editor is merely balancing her stable of opinion writers and I have no doubt which side Carey will end up on.

In other words, you see no difference between reporting facts and analysing facts?

[macdarawhitfield]

"For the past ten years the government flung money indiscriminately at people who could do without it. SSIA interest, automatic under-6’s child benefit bonus, over-70’s medical cards and inequitable tax allowances for high earners were all handed over as populist election winners. The money was crudely distributed and is being more crudely recouped, but I can’t help feeling it’s a case of easy come; easy go. What Fianna Fail giveth, Fianna Fail taketh away."

Yet you cannot see that Carey has a credibility problem having written the above analysis of the budget.

I have never heard of this Carey person but most people would accuse her of 'stating the bleeding obvious' I imagine.There is an argument to be had about Medical Cards for over 70s,I suppose,the rest is beyond dispute really ,especially the outrageous and completely immoral SSIA bribe.

But leave FF and Carey to one side and the finger is pointing at US.Somebody had to buy the snake oil - three elections in a row.