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  1. #11
    The_SR The_SR is online now

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    So long as they aren't suppressing I see no issue with putting a warning label on the Moldovian kids output.
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  2. #12
    fat finger fat finger is offline
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    The thing to worry about is not the high ideals of our EU masters, but the just doing our job shut up and know your place attitude of their enablers here on the ground

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  3. #13
    Analyzer Analyzer is offline
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    The nEU empire commission are now deciding what can be said about the nEU empire commission.

    This is all rather Orwellian.

    They can phuck off with themselves.

    Big Fill is in there with them. As if you needed any reason to justify the need for expression of scepticism.
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  4. #14
    Filibuster Filibuster is offline

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    That’s what I would call classic, panicked and BAD communication and is typical of the problem they have. You don’t throw a technocrat out as your only spokesperson and then try to “rescue them” when they get an awkward question.

    You need a free flow of information and to be clear about policy.

    The EU often gets so bogged down on technocratic language and poor, unclear presentation that it looks like deliberate burying of facts. Having interacted with EU agencies, I found that isn’t the case. They are just staffed by people who are chosen for technical academic qualifications and multilingualism. So, they tend to produce documents that seem to be aimed at political science researches and other academics, not the media.

    They’re often very poor choices of people to have interacting with the public and press as they also tend to speak “Euroese” instead of English (or French or German etc etc ). That happens because you’ve a Brussels Bubble that interacts with itself, in stilted, second language English (and second language other languages too).

    The whole thing is a communication train wreck. It reminds me of a university rather than a government body.

    Good communication isn't spin either. It's about being clear and open. The EU tends to be about mounds of badly presented facts and technical documentation. Even trying to navigate an EU website is painful. You feel like you're back in college trying to decipher some dense text that was never written with the idea that someone might actually read it!
    Last edited by Filibuster; 14th November 2017 at 10:50 AM.
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  5. #15
    brughahaha brughahaha is offline

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    Quote Originally Posted by Filibuster View Post
    To be fair, one of the biggest problems the EU has been ridiculously bad communication and an inability to respond to made up nonsense in the tabloids.

    The amount of stuff that is blamed on the EU in the UK papers in particular is crazy and in a lot of cases it’s used as both a whipping boy and bogeyman by local and national governments who want to implement something unpleasant, unpalatable or deal with something that they’ve made a complete cock up of.

    The amount of times (more so in the UK) where “European regulations” are blamed on some jobsworth, pedantic law or bureaucratic process that is entirely locally inflicted is shocking.

    Then you’ve got the euromyths where certain papers just make things up entirely or grossly misinterpret some technical regulation.

    I’m not saying this to defend everything the EU does, but if we want to actually have an accountable, functioning EU it needs to be able to communicate what it’s actually doing as opposed to what some tabloid hack who foams at the mouth when they hear the term Euro.

    Facts are facts and bull************************ is bull************************. If you mix the two you get a stinking mess. See: USA in 2017 for an illustration.
    Indeed Facts are facts ....but that has nothing to do with the EEAS

    Heres an example

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...n-false-claims

    So Catalan Independence demands (according to the EU propaganda unit) has nothing to do with 300 years of history expressed peacefully through the ballot box in every Spanish election .....no its the Russians stoking trouble

    Because we know the EU opposes Catalan Independence (and has turned a blind eye to its own principles to do so) so its agencies are provably involved in demonising , on behalf of the Spanish Government , the Independence movement

    Highly political , most certainly propaganda and a far cry from the " explaining EU regulations" guff , you're prepared to believe it does
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  6. #16
    Deadlock Deadlock is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by Filibuster View Post
    That’s what I would call classic, panicked and BAD communication and is typical of the problem they have. You don’t throw a technocrat out as your only spokesperson and then try to “rescue them” when they get an awkward question.

    You need a free flow of information and to be clear about policy.

    The EU often gets so bogged down on technocratic language and poor, unclear presentation that it looks like deliberate burying of facts. Having interacted with EU agencies, I found that isn’t the case. They are just staffed by people who are chosen for technical academic qualifications and multilingualism. So, they tend to produce documents that seem to be aimed at political science researches and other academics, not the media.

    They’re often very poor choices of people to have interacting with the public and press as they also tend to speak “Euroese” instead of English (or French or German etc etc ). That happens because you’ve a Brussels Bubble that interacts with itself, in stilted, second language English (and second language other languages too).

    The whole thing is a communication train wreck. It reminds me of a university rather than a government body.

    Good communication isn't spin either. It's about being clear and open. The EU tends to be about mounds of badly presented facts and technical documentation. Even trying to navigate an EU website is painful. You feel like you're back in college trying to decipher some dense text that was never written with the idea that someone might actually read it!

    I think that's a very reasonable and accurate picture.

    Flawed as it is, I think I'd prefer it as is, to a thoroughly opaque nebulous and quasi-truthyness Terry Prone job.
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  7. #17
    bormotello bormotello is offline
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    I definitely should speak with my GP about deja vu
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  8. #18
    Filibuster Filibuster is offline

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    The truth in that could easily be somewhere between several facts.
    That doesn't mean the Russians aren't stoking.

    You've a centuries old history of tensions between Catalonia and Spain.
    You've a massive economic crisis in Spain that is only beginning to be resolved.
    The economic crisis was mishandled by the Spanish government in the first place, they had huge issues around bank regulation, proximity of government to the causes of the mess etc
    Then you've the EU which handled the EU financial crisis very poorly and wasn't able to get beyond German and others' national interests and narrow dogmatic notions about public expenditure. Very limited solidarity was shown by other EU members. When push came to shove, it shows you're really on your own and many members are only good time friends who will abandon you and mock you in a crisis.
    The EU equally proved to be incapable of dealing with national governments pulling stunts like Greece did when it joined the Euro with massaged figures

    The EU proved to be fairly spineless against anything that national governments do, even if it's very damaging to the union.

    The along comes a whole raft of political actors looking for cracks to drive wedges into. They've found plenty of them in the US and the EU is full of them too.
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  9. #19
    Clanrickard Clanrickard is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by Filibuster View Post

    The EU often gets so bogged down on technocratic language and poor, unclear presentation that it looks like deliberate burying of facts. Having interacted with EU agencies, I found that isn’t the case. They are just staffed by people who are chosen for technical academic qualifications and multilingualism. So, they tend to produce documents that seem to be aimed at political science researches and other academics, not the media.

    They’re often very poor choices of people to have interacting with the public and press as they also tend to speak “Euroese” instead of English (or French or German etc etc ). That happens because you’ve a Brussels Bubble that interacts with itself, in stilted, second language English (and second language other languages too).

    The whole thing is a communication train wreck. It reminds me of a university rather than a government body.

    Good communication isn't spin either. It's about being clear and open. The EU tends to be about mounds of badly presented facts and technical documentation. Even trying to navigate an EU website is painful. You feel like you're back in college trying to decipher some dense text that was never written with the idea that someone might actually read it!
    Very good post. Worked with the Commission people for a year and found the same. I think their heart is in the right place but the technical nature of their documents and press releases allows for accusations of Orwelism and is grist to the mill of the Farages of this world. The EU certainly needs to combat fake news as it is a problem . WE cannot allow a nasty dictatorship like Russia to unbalance political discourse for its own nefarious ends.
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  10. #20
    Filibuster Filibuster is offline

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    The main thing they should do is simply improve the way they present information and I mean that in a mechanical sense.
    Tidy up the the language issues by using professional editors who are used to writing and editing good copy.

    Actually use channels of communication like social media and don’t just use them to link dull, technical press releases.

    I’ll give you an example of typical EU communication.

    I’m on a number of European Parliament and Commissions email lists as I was doing some university research. These are just public lists and anyone interested can join.

    On a particular day every week someone presses “send” and they fire out literally hundreds of emails with dense press releases. The volume is so huge and the way they are presented is so confusing that you would just react with OMFG stop!!

    I actually unsubscribed as I was being absolutely bombarded with mail.
    Even using filters wasn't very easy as they are so confusingly written that it's hard to sort using the subject lines.

    I’ve often had my phone going ping, pong, ping, ping as literally hundreds of documents are sent out simultaneously.

    I understand how it happens too. An office works its way through press releases and then they go through some kind of editing and sign off process, they're translated and some administrator just sends them out in bulk like as if they are using a 1980s fax machine or sending letters.

    They seem to take no account of who they're trying to talk to or what deadlines press might have and they make no attempt to digest the information or draw your attention to important facts.

    You could have some extremely important release about an upcoming change to something very relevant to Ireland and it's just treated as if it's as relevant as a document on the standardisation of adhesives for floor coverings in airport toilets.

    I don't think it's intentional but it comes across to media like as if they're trying to bury things and also they send out confusing technical documents that end up being interpreted arseways by some tabloids.

    Also this thing of quoting random people who aren't spokespeople as "Brussels says" and you then read down the article and discover that the statement actually came from an MEP representing seem obscure party with a weird agenda.
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