Private polling and focus groups indicate Lisbon 2 may be lost: Sunday Times

[hiding behind a poster]

As many times as you're made to...

No-one's making you vote, either.

[hiding behind a poster]

can anyone else verify that ones ballot paper is traceable ?,i know it was at one time but i thought things had changed.

No, its not traceable. See TO'B's post.

[edifice.]

No-one's making you vote, either.

It's your duty to vote, pity it isn't a duty to respect it.

[CookieMonster]

No-one's making you vote, either.

Brian Cowen is.

[Just Us]

The guarantees are legally binding on the 27 countries, and take the form of an international treaty, registered with the United Nations. To suggest they are false promises is either ill-informed or deliberately disingenuous.

They are no more than political promises & we know what they're worth. The 3 main components of the Yes Coalition, FF, FG & LP, all promised to lower taxes for the rich in the 07 GE [they called the rest of us "economic illiterates"!]; look at what has happened since. Say no more.

[McDave]

Does anyone have any perspectives on how the EU will make life more difficult for us? Can there not be a diversity of opinion within the bloc?

By my reading, it's not especially that there will be active steps to make life difficult for us. It's more that if Lisbon fails, I reckon there will be a renewed move by core EU states to press ahead with a higher level of political, social and economic integration that they can agree to. The current Nice-level treaties will then be left to operate as a kind of super-European Economic Area. We may be happy with this arrangement, but in such a scenario we'd no longer be at the top table/part of the core/at the heart of Europe (choose your own description!).

[edifice.]

By my reading, it's not especially that there will be active steps to make life difficult for us. It's more that if Lisbon fails, I reckon there will be a renewed move by core EU states to press ahead with a higher level of political, social and economic integration that they can agree to. The current Nice-level treaties will then be left to operate as a kind of super-European Economic Area. We may be happy with this arrangement, but in such a scenario we'd no longer be at the top table/part of the core/at the heart of Europe (choose your own description!).

So if they can move beyond the terms of existing treaties what's stopping them from doing so with Lisbon?

[McDave]

So if they can move beyond the terms of existing treaties what's stopping them from doing so with Lisbon?

If possible, better that all move forward a modest amount under Lisbon as a Union. But if this low level of compromise cannot be implemented, then alternatives have to be considered - the so-called two-speed Europe.

If Lisbon goes ahead, certain countries will be allowed to move ahead on certain policies, like common defence. But within the terms laid down by Lisbon. Any group of states moving outside Lisbon would be fundamentally calling the whole question of the Union into question.

[evercloserunion]

Brian Cowen is.

Don't vote so, and see if Brian Cowen cares.

[edifice.]

If possible, better that all move forward a modest amount under Lisbon as a Union. But if this low level of compromise cannot be implemented, then alternatives have to be considered - the so-called two-speed Europe.

If Lisbon goes ahead, certain countries will be allowed to move ahead on certain policies, like common defence. But within the terms laid down by Lisbon. Any group of states moving outside Lisbon would be fundamentally calling the whole question of the Union into question.

A bit of a contradiction there?