Should we run Lisbon before June?

[Question R24U]

The concensus appears to be that it will be in October rather than on the same day as locals/euro/by-elections.

But would it not be better to have Lisbon in March, rather than later?
My view:-
- it is better to have people voting in fear rather than anger (as of now sane non-FF'ers, the loo lahs and public servnats are mightidly pee'd off, but by Autum we can probably add social welfare recipients and all users of public services).
- it is more likley to be passed according to the lastest red c poll which showed a turn-around.
- it would demonstrate long-term commitmment to the European Project (blah blah blah) that international markets appear to crave.
- many of those who might have voted yes, could have emigrated by the Autumn.
- momentum could be built for a National Effort for recovery during the campaign (they could also throw in a few positive reasons to vote yes).
- the opposition should advise that the local election campaign just around the corner be used for kicking the government.
- Cowen (in his 6 o'clock state of nation address, which for some reason was not shown on the 9 o'c news) has re-found the ability to speak to people in plain and passionate language - this should be kept.

What do you think?

[Big Bobo]

My opinion is we already voted on this and the people's wishes should be respected.

[Eorna]

"Better to have the people voting in fear rather than Anger."

You are doing your best to convince people that the Yes side are pure evil.

Rather than just misguided people following our great leader Cowen.

[evercloserunion]

"Better to have the people voting in fear rather than Anger."

You are doing your best to convince people that the Yes side are pure evil.

Rather than just misguided people following our great leader Cowen.

I suppose as a No voter you'd rather they vote in anger than in fear, which is just as bad.

[FutureTaoiseach]

The last Red C poll last time also showed a lead for the yes side by 42-39 and we know what happened. Go ahead - make my day. It will be seen a rush job and the poll-figures will start to turn to the no side's advantage and then the protest groups spawned by the govt's (necessary) cuts will back the no side like the hospital-groups did last time. People want to punish the govt and this would be the first opportunity. So go ahead - make my day.

[eurosceptic]

It would be impractical to run it so soon as the unions, farmers and all the sectional interests have to be fully on board. Plus the main parties dont want it to be an issue at the locals & europeans and give libertas and sinn fein in particular lots of airtime. October is the likely date but with the economy tieing everyone up it might even be put off until early 2010 (if gordon brown goes to term).

[fergalr]

SIPTU won't back it without legislation on collective bargaining. I believe forcing businesses to recognise unions is unconstitutional but for the life of me I can't remember the case.
Farmers fouled up last time so I imagine they'll fall into line. Even if the unions did as well, the attitude on the streets is mutinous towards any authority right now. Cooler hears are unlikely to prevail, I'm sorry to say.

[eurosceptic]

Ferg has identified a key point, the govt came within a hairs breadth of pulling a fast one on the unions. The charter would get legal status but the workers rights provisions which are dormant without national legislation would never be activated, thus IBEC would never feel any pain. At the last minute Jack O'Connor spotted this and demanded clarification of this point - which never came.
How the govt are going to ride the two horses now is hard to see.

[fergalr]

There is honestly little chance of this FF cowtowing to the unions on this, not after their having dug in on public sector cuts. Bertie might have, but I dunno about Cowen. And I give little credence to any Lisbon polls conducted when there's no referendum campaign actually happening. Members of my own family were so credulous as to buy into Coir's land of the blind campaign last year. God only knows what's to come next.

[Question R24U]

SIPTU won't back it without legislation on collective bargaining. I believe forcing businesses to recognise unions is unconstitutional but for the life of me I can't remember the case.
Farmers fouled up last time so I imagine they'll fall into line. Even if the unions did as well, the attitude on the streets is mutinous towards any authority right now. Cooler hears are unlikely to prevail, I'm sorry to say.

That would be a very good reason to avoid delaying. To hell with the Lobbyists (sorry Social Partners) - they have had enough influence already and look where it has got us. It is time for Political leadership to stand up and be counted and let the People decide (again) - but this time it is for keeps - Lisbon or bust.

* As for being pure evil (thankfully there are no real people here only hacks), having had pangs of conscience over the last few weeks over how FF since 2001 have made an arse of the economy (again) - I was relieved to re-consider that until we change the electoral system to a list based one - that FF + green (now) or labour (for the 1916 centenary) are still better than the a schizonphrenic main opposition party (ye can't have it both ways boys - cuts or services) and a bleating heart Labour Party, who's policies would ensure more people will be in the labour exchanges than anywhere else.