Open letter to the Irish

[Naive EU activist]

Hello,

In the spirit of European diversity, my letter to you is in English. And, in the spirit of European integration, I am trying to not care about your “no” to this treaty that I believed in so sincerely. I am not disappointed with you in any way, it is your constitutional right to tell your political leaders and the rest of Europe EXACTLY what you think about these EU treaties. I’m just a bit sad, I guess.

It feels bizarre getting all worked up over a treaty. But, it’s actually quite understandable. I don’t mean to ramble on about my life or anything, but people of Ireland, I’m quite new to the EU and its inner-workings. Last year, I couldn’t give a hoot about the EU institutions. Now, I do because I’ve gotten excited about European integration! That is why I joined “Sauvons l’Europe” – because I believed in slowly creating a democratically legitimate European Union. I thought, and I guess I still do, that the Lisbon Treaty was the best short-term step towards that ultimate goal. Now I’ve encountered my first reality check on the European project, and I don’t know how to react.

I know that this “no” doesn’t necessarily mean that the treaty won’t pass. There are other ways…compromises…second (third?) referendums. But whenever I hear talk about these “plan Bs”, I instantly get turned off. It seems like most people don’t really care about your “no”, which is saddening to me. I always thought that in the end, politicians would still care about the voice of the people. Apparentely not. So, if I’m disappointed with someone, it’s definitely not with you, it’s with them! How dare they? To me, the treaty has lost most, if not all, of its legitimacy. And no one cares.

Naïvely yours,

A lost European activist

[The Earl of Desmond]

Shouldn't your letter be in Irish not English? You know our national language - or are you so badly informed that you did not know that we have our own national language?

[greengoose]

Shouldn't your letter be in Irish not English? You know our national language - or are you so badly informed that you did not know that we have our own national language?

It's not that badly written that readers won't understand what he is saying but were it written as Gaeilge I'm sure that 90% of the readers here wouln not understand more than cupla focail. Cupla = 2 :mrgreen:

[Demotruk]

Shouldn't your letter be in Irish not English? You know our national language - or are you so badly informed that you did not know that we have our own national language?

Maybe they're informed enough to know that half of us would have no idea what they're saying.

[imokyrok]

Shouldn't your letter be in Irish not English? You know our national language - or are you so badly informed that you did not know that we have our own national language?

Is it really necessary to be that rude to someone who'd obviously making a effort to communicate. I do apologise Naive - manners is not his strong point.

[The Earl of Desmond]

Also - all we did was ask the EU to hand on a second and slow down while we think about this decision - this entire Treaty was designed by a few hundred people - the senior officials, some former leaders, senior lobbists, senior business people and the like because most of the politicians have moved on by the time things get done in the EU so the officials don't care what they think. The people whose whispers are listened to are the shday 'advisers' and the like who freely wander the corridors of the EU.

At the moment the EU and political class are very very angry at being told No.

But they'll calm down when they realise that to just ignore Ireland's vote will make them even more unpopular and will lead to even bigger headaches for them.

I think they know - but will never admit in public - that it is not just Ireland, it is France and Holland and probably other countries too who do not feel any connection emotionally to the EU.

That has to be changed.

Also, I think we all know when someone joins and there first post is 'poor little old me doesn't really know much about ...' - this person is probably Barosso!

[MartinP]

I know that this “no” doesn’t necessarily mean that the treaty won’t pass.

Well, unanimity from all member states is required for the ratification of the Treaty and given our refusal to do so means that the Treaty should not be ratified. We'll see how democratic the European project is in the not too distant future.

There are other ways…compromises…second (third?) referendums.

There will be no second or third referenda on this. The 26 county administration's reason for doing Nice II was there didn't exist enough information for people to make an informed choice the first time. That can't be said this time.

[Slacker]

In fairness, I never heard of the Citizen's Initiative and the recognition of Countries Leaving the EU until after the vote.

Naive, some of us didn't reject the treaty outright.

Some of us would like Mr. Cowen to ask the people, "what don't you like?", go make changes, and then, once he's modified it, maybe he can come back to us and say "OK, I got this this and this changed, do you want to vote on it again?."

If it's a no at that stage, then he can leave it.

If not, we willingly vote again.

Earl, if this was a conversation around a bar, I would slap you across the face for your first remark, you sanctimonious little so-and-so!

(mods: apologies for attacking the poster not the post, but that was the rudest thing I have ever seen!)

[imokyrok]

[quote=MartinP]

I know that this “no” doesn’t necessarily mean that the treaty won’t pass.

Well, unanimity from all member states is required for the ratification of the Treaty and given our refusal to do so means that the Treaty should not be ratified. We'll see how democratic the European project is in the not too distant future.

There are other ways…compromises…second (third?) referendums.

There will be no second or third referenda on this. The 26 county administration's reason for doing Nice II was there didn't exist enough information for people to make an informed choice the first time. That can't be said this time.[/quote:3ke3ndbj]

So you are saying there will be no re-negotiation despite Sinn Feins pre-election claims?

[goosebump]

Shouldn't your letter be in Irish not English? You know our national language - or are you so badly informed that you did not know that we have our own national language?

Well done, fatload.