Lisbon: 'Outrageous Irish Times Editorial June 7

[Eternal Optimist]

'Are we out of our minds?'

Well well, the Old Lady of D'olier Street (or should that be Tara Street?) has definitely gone over the top this time.

It was enough to see the IT fall into the sheepishness of advocating a yes vote by almost all of its commentators, nauseating to have the opponents of the treaty regularly pilloried in the Turner cartoons, but the tone of the editorial was, put simply, a disgrace.

I have noticed a decline in the journalistic standards of this paper over the recent past and this editorial - wholly subjective and dismissive - takes the biscuit. The closing argument that equated voting no with being irrational has pushed me into dismissing anything that spews from that paper from now on. I expected a lot better from the Irish Times. I wonder is that paper really an independent trust after reading this editorial.

[Eternal Optimist]

And, for once, this is the excellent response from the Sindo.

http://www.independent.ie/national-n...n-1401935.html


Do not take us for granted, and do not treat us like fools. Next time -- and be assured, there will be a next time -- deliver a treaty that is readable, accessible and understandable.

Then explain why it is necessary, show what it will achieve and put it to the vote across Europe, and not just on this small island. That, more than anything, would convince me that a new treaty was worth voting for, because it would demonstrate that every European political leader was prepared to stand and be counted.

<MOD> An interesting read, but please don't quote full articles, use the link provided</MOD>

[Solipsist]

So the IT wants us to vote yes because its embarrassing if we dont. But the Sindo saying we should vote no uses the reasoning my wife does sometimes [color=#BF0000]Do not take us for granted, and do not treat us like fools.[/color] Its the bland leading the bland

[goosebump]

The great and the good know what's best for us, and we should just trust them and move on.

Well I can't. I do not trust them. I cannot stand being patronised, threatened, bullied and lied to, all at the same time, especially when the people doing the bullying have not bothered to read and understand the very document that they are trying to ram down my throat.

That is reason enough to vote No, and it is why so many people have turned against the Lisbon Treaty in the past few weeks. We are being browbeaten, and we do not like it.

ASSERT YOUR DEMOCRATIC RIGHTS!

LET THE WORLD KNOW THAT YOU'RE THICK AND PROUD!

[Eternal Optimist]

The great and the good know what's best for us, and we should just trust them and move on.

Well I can't. I do not trust them. I cannot stand being patronised, threatened, bullied and lied to, all at the same time, especially when the people doing the bullying have not bothered to read and understand the very document that they are trying to ram down my throat.

That is reason enough to vote No, and it is why so many people have turned against the Lisbon Treaty in the past few weeks. We are being browbeaten, and we do not like it.

ASSERT YOUR DEMOCRATIC RIGHTS!

LET THE WORLD KNOW THAT YOU'RE THICK AND PROUD!

By voting yes

[jpc]

Very eloquently put by Alan Ruddock.
The Yes vote campaign has been totally without conviction in what the ideals of the European union are about.
Vote yes or you are an idiot.What will the sophisticated European electorate think of a shower of begrudgers out in the Atlantic.
Thats the yes arguement.
Why haven't the european electorate been asked to ok this very large change in the way THEIR lives are going to be governed?
No one really answered that question in the EU halls of power.
They didn't consider it necessary either I would suspect.

[KingKane]

And, for once, this is the excellent response from the Sindo.

http://www.independent.ie/national-n...n-1401935.html
By Alan Ruddock

deliver a ... that is readable, accessible and understandable.

- Alan Ruddock

If only this is what Alan could commit to getting from his own employer.

[Eternal Optimist]

And, for once, this is the excellent response from the Sindo.

http://www.independent.ie/national-n...n-1401935.html
By Alan Ruddock

deliver a ... that is readable, accessible and understandable.

- Alan Ruddock

If only this is what Alan could commit to getting from his own employer.

Unfortunately we are not voting on the Sindo. Suppose such a vote could only take place via telephone polls...

[goosebump]

Vote yes or you are an idiot.

Nobody has said vote Yes or you are an idiot.

People have said make an informed decision, either by doing some research and placing your trust in someone.

Voting no because you aren't prepared to do either, or because you think that voting No will have no impact on your life, is idiotic.

[jpc]

Vote yes or you are an idiot.

Nobody has said vote Yes or you are an idiot.

People have said make an informed decision, either by doing some research and placing your trust in someone.

Voting no because you aren't prepared to do either, or because you think that voting No will have no impact on your life, is idiotic.

Lets be clear .That is what is being intamated by some of the more lazy yes campaigners
Yes. People should make an informed decision.
We are the only nationstate in Europe that have that right.
It is a huge responsibility.
I only wish that the EU and the yes campaign understood that fact as well.
I am not convinced that the EU will function any better than it currently does if this treaty is enacted.
That is why I choose to vote NO.