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About LinkBacksSonny O'Neill?Originally Posted by The Red Rose of Cork
Sonny O'Neill?
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He's not a British Royal RoC.You do understand David however, that this will most likely be one of the tactics used by your opponents to smear you.. suggestions of financial impropriety leading you to be some kind of unpatriotic shadowy figures..
I hope you never went to a fancy dress party dressed as a Nazi...Political Parties are open about their funding, and political groups should be too. Given the strong possibility of foreign funds being used to try and sway a vote here, how campaigns and advertising is funded is a very reasonable question.
Economic Left/Right: -3.13; Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -1.64
“University politics are so vicious, precisely because the stakes are so small.” Henry Kissinger
and what do you propose they do exactly. This process started in 2002 when the idea of the constitution was 1st put forward.Libertas is a pro-Europe organisation that wants greater transparency, accountabilty and democracy in the European Union.
We've set out specific reasons on the website (and in the press release) why we believe this treaty is a bad deal not just for Ireland, but every citizen of Europe.
5 years later (and more), at least two major intergovernmental conferences countless meetings both national levels and EU levels various citizen meetings and 4 referenda
This seems to be the best they can come up with
What do you sugest they do
"We know what to do, we just dont know how to get elected afterwards" Jean-Claude Juncker on how to fix the European economy
The Treaties are completely silent on the issue of referenda. This is solely a matter for the member state. The Crotty judgement laid down the principle that generally these questions were for the people and not the Dail but it must involve some transfer of sovereignty. Again this is solely a matter for us so the claim that we will not be asked again or that "Europe" will not let us have a say is false...a poor start for a group aiming to raise awareness
The point about new areas of QMV is quite right and indeed a democratic reform...why should one country out of 27 be able to block everything on the EU agenda, 500,000 in Malta could block reforms that countries representing 400m want, hardly the most democratic situation.
The potential future extension of QMV will I suspect be covered in the wording as it was before
Yes, I will be supporting the No campaign, It is time to say enough is enough, One only has to see the total farcial excercise today in signing this treay,whereby thousands and probaly hundreds of thousands of Euros were spent in moving these so called Euopean leaders to sign this.
Libertas has today launched it's "No to Lisbon" campaign in Dublin.
More information is available from the relaunched Libertas website, which contains an overview of key points that in Libertas's view, should pursuade people to vote no.
The press release, and more, are available on the Libertas homepage.
Are people to be kept on being fooled forever, the EU unfortuantely is a complete undemocratic nightmare.the Ideals of the EU when it started were great, but it has been hijacked by the Big Corporations, the Pharmaceutical businesses. the Military etc,etc
Say NO
I knew there was something I did wrong that would scar my political life, verdammit.You do understand David however, that this will most likely be one of the tactics used by your opponents to smear you.. suggestions of financial impropriety leading you to be some kind of unpatriotic shadowy figures..I'd love to be able to answer that question - but unfortunately I'm not in a position to do that. I'm being as open and honest as I can be, but I'm not the person doing everything for Libertas!
I hope you never went to a fancy dress party dressed as a Nazi...
Dan Sullivan. I was back but we still couldn't all have a vote.
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I welcome the fact that debate on the treaty is taking place but it is a pity that Libertas should have launched their campaign by misrepresenting what's in the treaty, as Smiffy has pointed out.
Art.48 outlines two senarios for amending the treaties: i) the method used to prepare the Constitution (i.e. via a Convention) and ii) the traditional IGC method. There are clear distinctions as to what changes each method can bring about but in both cases it is stated that the amendments do not come into effect unless 'ratified by all the Member States in accordance with their respective constitutional requirements'. That means that if a national constitution requires a referendum, then a referendum will be held.
It's simply not true to say therefore as Libertas does that the new Art.48 'will allow significant changes to be made to the way the EU is run, without the need for further referenda in Ireland or elsewhere.
The new Art.48 is available on p.51 of http://consilium.europa.eu/uedocs/cmsUp ... 4.en07.pdf
That would make sense if the EU was a single country but at present it is not and some of the proponents of this treaty say it doesn't make it one. But it effectively does. A system allowing laws to be passed by majority of the states is more akin to a Federal State that a mere international organisation. While I was willing to accept this on issues of trade and enviornment as now, I am totally opposed to extending it to domestic issues like immigration, taxation, social-welfare and questions of war and peace. This Treaty in reality turns the EU into a Federal State in the fullest sense of the word. We can forced into a war by QMV. We can have our immigration, taxation, and social-welfare policy decided by France and Germany and the other states - no matter what Irish public-opinion has to say on the matter. That is not democracy. That is the extermination of Irish independence. The new Act of Union.
I am pro-European as the next man, and I strongly support our membership of this club and the Euro currency. But there comes a point at which one has to say that as more and more power is being centralised, at what point does the EU cease being a mere international organisation and start being a State? In Washington, they pass laws that override those of the 50 states. Under Lisbon, this will happen to a degree comparable to in the US. In short, it makes the EU a state. This is the inescapable reality and those who vote for this should have that on their conscience. If they are supporting this Treaty because they want a Federal European state then they should come out of the closet and say so. Let's have a debate based on honesty, not the deception of previous treaties.
Hmm. What is the difference, in principle, between a democratic Irish state and a democratic EU?That would make sense if the EU was a single country but at present it is not and some of the proponents of this treaty say it doesn't make it one. But it effectively does. A system allowing laws to be passed by majority of the states is more akin to a Federal State that a mere international organisation. While I was willing to accept this on issues of trade and enviornment as now, I am totally opposed to extending it to domestic issues like immigration, taxation, social-welfare and questions of war and peace. This Treaty in reality turns the EU into a Federal State in the fullest sense of the word. We can forced into a war by QMV. We can have our immigration, taxation, and social-welfare policy decided by France and Germany and the other states - no matter what Irish public-opinion has to say on the matter. That is not democracy. That is the extermination of Irish independence. The new Act of Union.
I am pro-European as the next man, and I strongly support our membership of this club and the Euro currency. But there comes a point at which one has to say that as more and more power is being centralised, at what point does the EU cease being a mere international organisation and start being a State? In Washington, they pass laws that override those of the 50 states. Under Lisbon, this will happen to a degree comparable to in the US. In short, it makes the EU a state. This is the inescapable reality and those who vote for this should have that on their conscience. If they are supporting this Treaty because they want a Federal European state then they should come out of the closet and say so. Let's have a debate based on honesty, not the deception of previous treaties.
Never let the best be the enemy of the good.
phreedum!
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