Irish Mirror Exclusive - Izevbekhai FGM story a lie

[Vega1447]

Too little too late, The Nigerian Government is constant rebuked for this practice internationally yet they do nothing and the numbers of children exposed to this barbaric practice remains shockingly high.

It’s a customary practice actively condoned by many in Nigeria.

Kevin,
I asked 4 questions - not 1.

Have you any answer to 1,2 or 3?

1. Has *anyone* contacted the father's extended family to hear their story?
2. Are the father's extended family (supposedly avidly awaiting the girls' return so that they can inflict this abuse on them) not open to reason, negotiation or - in extremis - threats?
3. Even if 1 & 2 are conceded could not security measures be taken - we are told that Ms. I and her husband are financially comfortable.
4. If Ms. I and her children are deported to Nigeria and her children were subjected to fgm the Nigerian Govt would be rightly crucified by international donors and international opinion. Even in their own selfish self-interest they could not afford to let it happen.

[Kevin Doyle]

This is the nub of the issue and the reason for the PR campaign being run here,if they can get this one through the courts then they will have established grounds for anyone in future to use the same excuse.This is their agenda.

PR campaign? Take off the tinfoil hat will you, I'm a concerned citizen with children of my own who would do what PI did and more to protect my children.

FGM is already grounds for claiming asylum, there is no precedent to set.

[Trampas]

Trampas, what relevance do a hypothetical influx of African families have to the legal arguments in this case?

Also, Ireland is not alone in subscribing to the UN Convention Against Torture so the legal basis for gaining asylum on these grounds apply also in all other countries which have subscribed to it. Given that these laws apply in so many other countries why do you expect an influx into Ireland in particular?

It does not matter whether other countries also receive an influx on FGM grounds. There are about a billion people out there who could claim to be fleeing FGM.

[Kevin Doyle]

Has *anyone* contacted the father's extended family to hear their story?]

So far, no.

Are the father's extended family (supposedly avidly awaiting the girls' return so that they can inflict this abuse on them) not open to reason, negotiation or - in extremis - threats?

If they where open to reason in this issue then the whole case for FGM would become moot, as I said this is a cultural practice with significant stigmas attached for girls who are not mutilated. The Nigerian Government may threaten the family but that will be a short term stop gap measure, in a years time after all the international attention has died down the threat could very well reemerge and the children summarily mutilated. You cannot reverse a cultural indoctrination such as this without massive and systematic change within the cultural make up of those who view this practice as necessary

Even if 1 & 2 are conceded could not security measures be taken - we are told that Ms. I and her husband are financially comfortable.

Which in itself begs the question, if she is financially comfortable in Nigeria with substantial means and there is no viable threat to her children, why the hell is she holed up in a dormitory in the west of Ireland in relative destitution?

[Kevin Doyle]

It does not matter whether other countries also receive an influx on FGM grounds. There are about a billion people out there who could claim to be fleeing FGM.

Of course it matters. It is an essential component of your precedent argument, so far you have offered nothing to back up your claims that allowing these children to stay would open the flood gates.

[DaveM]

It does not matter whether other countries also receive an influx on FGM grounds. There are about a billion people out there who could claim to be fleeing FGM.

It does matter because the underlying suggestion is that Ireland in particular would be opening some kind of floodgate through setting of a precedent. That is not a well founded argument. FGM is a form of torture. Where persons claim asylum under the UN Convention Against Torture it is up to the legal authority to establish whether their particular case is well founded. If they find that it is then the country in question is obliged to grant asylum. That is what countries who have subscribed to the UN Convention Against Torture have signed up to. Cases will be assessed on merit, not solely on precendent, and to suggest otherwise is a misrepresentation.

[bob3344]

Where persons claim asylum under the UN Convention Against Torture it is up to the legal authority to establish whether their particular case is well founded. If they find that it is then the country in question is obliged to grant asylum.

She has failed the hurdle. Why then are people arguing that she should stay ?

Can't have it both ways.

i.e. you cannot reassure people that FGM will only result in a trickle of asylum seekers because each case is judged on its own merits, and then immediately turn around and argue that this woman should be allowed stay even though she has failed in her bid.

[DaveM]

Kevin,
I asked 4 questions - not 1.

Have you any answer to 1,2 or 3?

1. Has *anyone* contacted the father's extended family to hear their story?
2. Are the father's extended family (supposedly avidly awaiting the girls' return so that they can inflict this abuse on them) not open to reason, negotiation or - in extremis - threats?
3. Even if 1 & 2 are conceded could not security measures be taken - we are told that Ms. I and her husband are financially comfortable.
4. If Ms. I and her children are deported to Nigeria and her children were subjected to fgm the Nigerian Govt would be rightly crucified by international donors and international opinion. Even in their own selfish self-interest they could not afford to let it happen.

Vega, these are valid questions.

You'd have to address the first point to the Garda Immigration Bureau I'd say. Given that for 4 years they did not contest the factual grounds of PI's case as substantiated by falsified documentation I would have my doubts. However the fact that PI falsified documents should not give rise to adverse assumptions on other aspects of the case prejudicial against her and her children.


On the second point I do not know. However my opinion would be if the threat has been made I would not accept a sudden retraction of that threat at this point of the case.

On the thrid and forth points the Nigerian government's record on protecting it's citizens against FGM is terrible and I doubt the reaction of the Irish media in the event of these girls being subjected to FGM would cause them a minutes concern. Their ambassador to Ireland has already seen nothing wrong in directly contradicting the statistics that their government provided to the UN on the prevalence of FGM and that kind of moral ambiguity on the perpetration of torture against children is deeply disquieting. Why should we now trust the Nigerian government to protect these girls when they have failed miserably to protect so many others?

[Vega1447]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin Doyle
Has *anyone* contacted the father's extended family to hear their story?]

[COLOR=Red]So far, no.[/COLOR]

Seems a bit odd that no-one in LetThemStay or more widely among her supporters here and in Nigeria (she does *have* supporters there??) has investigated this.

Quote:
Are the father's extended family (supposedly avidly awaiting the girls' return so that they can inflict this abuse on them) not open to reason, negotiation or - in extremis - threats?

[COLOR=Red]If they where open to reason in this issue then the whole case for FGM would become moot, as I said this is a cultural practice with significant stigmas attached for girls who are not mutilated. The Nigerian Government may threaten the family but that will be a short term stop gap measure, in a years time after all the international attention has died down the threat could very well reemerge and the children summarily mutilated. You cannot reverse a cultural indoctrination such as this without massive and systematic change within the cultural make up of those who view this practice as necessary.[/COLOR]

This stretches credibility - as does the whole story. We are asked to believe that the father just accepted the fact that his family kidnapped his daughter and mutilated her. And that the father took *no* action as a consequence..


Quote:
Even if 1 & 2 are conceded could not security measures be taken - we are told that Ms. I and her husband are financially comfortable.

[COLOR=Red]Which in itself begs the question, if she is financially comfortable in Nigeria with substantial means and there is no viable threat to her children, why the hell is she holed up in a dormitory in the west of Ireland in relative destitution?
[/COLOR]

Maybe she is delusional?

Put it simply, if an extended family group were plotting to kidnap and mutilate my children, I would threaten them with extreme consequences.

If an extended family group actually kidnapped and mutilated my children, I would visit those extreme consequences on them.

One of the many things that doesn't ring true about Ms. I's story is the complete lack of anger towards those she claims caused the mutilation and death of her daughter.

[Metric]

Do we even know who these people were who suppposedly killed her daughters? Why has she not informed the relevant Nigerian authorities of the murder?