"We'll never get justice" says mother of Irishman shot by US police.

[swansandtyphus]

I agree completely. If Gonzales had been issued with a Tazer, however, Hanlon would still be alive

A Tazer is only effective if the suspect is standing sufficiently close and stationary for the spring taser to strike him and if the shock has any effect.

If Gonzales missed or if Hanlon was so crazed that he ignored the pain, Gonzales would have been forced to use his gun.

There are many myths and misconceptions of these situations that are on cop shows.

Gonzales was a trained cage fighter but the street does not operate like the controlled environment of combat sports.

The martial arts and weapons training that police forces experience are merely a guide for real life.

The only reason police in the Republic of Ireland are most unarmed and until recently did not wear stab vests is because of the almost compete absence of a gun and knife culture in Ireland until recently.

In societies like America where guns and knives are carried by most criminals and police deaths are common, officers do not take chances and if confronted with a suspect they will assume they must use deadly force if there is trouble.

Hanlon refused to comply with the orders of an armed officer with a drawn gun and the officer had to assume he meant business and so he opened fire.

Very tragic but unavoidable in the circumstances.

[The OD]

I'm afraid she is right - the guy shot her obviously had no problem shooting someone, he certainly had no problem destroying other lives in his sick pursuit of his twisted gratification, so whats one more life destroyed?

The authoritites certainly dont seem to care either?

[Estragon]

Oh yeah, they were asking for it.
Nothing at all to do with a criminal cop using wildly excessive force against a civilian whom he knew to be unarmed and getting away with it.

I have no problem with your point, but I do think that if his family loved him as much as they have professed to since, he would never have been in the situation in the first place.

[Utopian Hermit Monk]

Andrew Hanlon's death was a terrible tragedy. Generally, he seems to have had a pleasant personality, and he made friends easily. But the underlying psychological condition sometimes led to irrational, threatening behaviour. It seems that his own sister had been forced to evict him after several violent episodes, and he was trying to find her house on the night he was shot.

Officer Gonzalez was also a troubled individual, as subsequent events illustrate. Part of the tragedy is the fact that this particular policeman happened to respond to the call on the night in question. At the time of the shooting, I couldn't help reflecting on the bravery of our own unarmed Gardaí, who regularly confront, and even disarm (remember the Dick Roche episode?) armed criminals.

Andrew was neither armed nor very dangerous, but his behaviour on the night was irrational and threatening. I'm sure part of the family's grief is related to questions about what they could have done differently, but they certainly aren't to blame for what eventually transpired.

In such cases, when the past cannot be undone, one can only hope that lessons will be learned. The Silverton Police Dept. certainly need to learn a lesson about how to handle a psychologically disturbed person. Families of people exhibiting signs of inner disturbance need to learn that such cases need professional intervention at the earliest opportunity.

May Andrew's soul rest peacefully.

[candi]

He was out of his dept in that country. A sad happening but in Rome you must do as the Romans do.

US of A have a different culture and different methods.

It is sad he had to die but he should not have been in, or allowed by his guardians to be in such a situation.

I know a guy who was always failing to stop his high powered motor cycle for the Guards here in Ireland driving through their checkpoints. Every body knew him.
He went to the States and tried the same thing with the Police there.

They hunted him down until he lost control, hit a side walk and got killed.

Who was wrong there?

[The OD]

I have no problem with your point, but I do think that if his family loved him as much as they have professed to since, he would never have been in the situation in the first place.

Regale us, good Estragon, with your anecdotes about how you successfully managed to keep a mentally ill adult under 24 watch?

Did you chain them to a radiator? Drug them?

Because if someone suffers from a mental illness, its exceptionally difficult to care for them all the time, especially if you have other people to consider?

Personally, I think your comments above are quite unfair - how can you presume to know how much his family loved him? Looking after a relative with mental illness is an exhausting job at the best of times and heartbreaking too.

The fact is, he was acting in a way that could be perceived to be threatening to some, I dont doubt that at all, but the other fact is that an utter piece of filth was sent out to deal with him, a man who obviously has no ability to empathise with other human being - as to whether or not this was known at the time is another matter, but for someone like this ex-officer, pulling the trigger was probably as easy as some of his other ''interests''.

[louis bernard]

I agree completely. If Gonzales had been issued with a Tazer, however, Hanlon would still be alive.

If the police force in question had properly vetted this character (who is now in prison for sexually abusing a child) perhaps this tragedy would have been averted.

[swansandtyphus]

If the police force in question had properly vetted this character (who is now in prison for sexually abusing a child) perhaps this tragedy would have been averted.

The fact that it later emerged that Gonzales was a child abuser is irrelevant.

Any other officer would have reacted the same way in that situation.

Gonzales called for Hanlon to show his hands.

Hanlon continued to advance on him, swinging his fists and kicking out.

Gonzales did not know whether Hanlon was armed with stabbing weapon or not.

Witnesses to the shooting backed Gonzales' version of events - none of whom knew either Hanlon or Gonzales and indeed both Gonzales and Hanlon were also complete strangers.

Gonzales believed his life was in danger and opened fire.

His actions were supported by the official report and declared "justified."

[Andrew49]

The first response of Gonzalez was to shoot Andrew
The second response of Gonzalez was to shoot Andrew
The third response of Gonzalez was to shoot Andrew
The fourth response of Gonzalez was to shoot Andrew
The fifth response of Gonzalez was to shoot Andrew
The sixth response of Gonzalez was to shoot Andrew
The seventh response of Gonzalez was to shoot Andrew

Gonzalez hit Andrew 5 times ... and according to testimony Andrew was never more than five feet from Gonzalez ... as he was shooting.

Andrew was slaughtered by Gonzalez - and this murder is not going away.

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jrPxsjr25QQ"]YouTube - A Killing In Silverton City Oregon[/ame]

[louis bernard]

“The fact that it later emerged that Gonzales was a child abuser is irrelevant.”

It most certainly is not irrelevant; a child abuser is an extreme criminal and sexual deviant of the worst type. People (if you could describe such as people) are capable of anything and this animal should never have been allowed next or near the police force.