Gormley's Car Tax Repugnant to equal treatment

[mairteenpak]

Road Tax

The following is a statement from Minister Gormley regarding the new motor tax system. Please use our motor tax calculator above to calculate your motor tax.

"Minister Gormley stated that all new cars registered from 1 July 2008 will have their motor tax rate based on the CO2 emissions level. The new CO2 based system will not apply to the import of pre 2008 cars. New cars registered between 1 January 2008 and 30 June 2008 will initially have their motor tax charged on the basis of the existing engine size (c.c.) system. However, a low CO2 emitting new car registered between 1 January 2008 and 30 June 2008 will have its motor tax switched to the lower CO2 based motor tax rate on first renewal of motor tax post 1 July 2008, when the new CO2 based system commences. New cars which are registered in the first 6 months of 2008 whose tax would be more under the new CO2 based system will continue to pay motortax on the basis of engine size.

http://www.vrt.ie/roadTax.php

The situation wherein tow people with the same model of car will pay different rates of road tax is silly, just because one of the people was first to take the initiative to buy an environmentally friendly vehicle.

Since the tax is levied on an annual basis the taxes should bear equally on persons with the same make of car.

Article 40

1. All citizens shall, as human persons, be held equal before the law.

This shall not be held to mean that the State shall not in its enactments have due regard to differences of capacity, physical and moral, and of social function

Discriminating on the basis of when the car war bought seems to be problematic.


Private Property

Article 43

1. 1° The State acknowledges that man, in virtue of his rational being, has the natural right, antecedent to positive law, to the private ownership of external goods.

2° The State accordingly guarantees to pass no law attempting to abolish the right of private ownership or the general right to transfer, bequeath, and inherit property.

2. 1° The State recognises, however, that the exercise of the rights mentioned in the foregoing provisions of this Article ought, in civil society, to be regulated by the principles of social justice.

2° The State, accordingly, may as occasion requires delimit by law the exercise of the said rights with a view to reconciling their exercise with the exigencies of the common good.

[myk]

I believe you have already shown from the Angelus thread that your understand of constitutional law in Ireland is poor.

[returning officer]

I believe you have already shown from the Angelus thread that your understand of constitutional law in Ireland is poor.

I think this shows an inability to read the English language. The phrase "as human persons" does not equate to car owners, just because vehicles are driven by humans and in most cases owned by them and I cannot understand how you got past Article 43.2.1 and 43.2.2, even on a wharped undertstanding of private property rights.

It is back on ignore for Marteenpak (who was far better when he just reguritated more intelligent posters rants; at least he could get them to agree with him).

[michael1965]

In a way it's kind of cynical. They want to influence future behaviour, but don't need to waste money rewarding past, good behaviour, therefore saving money. But, is it unconstitutional? I think that would be a stretch and I can't see it really.

[ivnryn]

In a way it's kind of cynical. They want to influence future behaviour, but don't need to waste money rewarding past, good behaviour, therefore saving money. But, is it unconstitutional? I think that would be a stretch and I can't see it really.

However, by not rewarding past good behaviour that wan't legally required, they discourage future good behaviour that isn't legally required.

People will not be incentived to perform 'good' actions Today that they assume will be legally encouraged in the future.

[goosebump]

Applying the tax to older cars would also tear the @rse out of every Local Authority budget in the country.

Everybody can't expect to benefit from every tax change. Should we pay the Early Childhood Supplement to everyone in the country given that at some stage in their lives they were under 6 years old?

[joemomma]

Everybody can't expect to benefit from every tax change. Should we pay the Early Childhood Supplement to everyone in the country given that at some stage in their lives they were under 6 years old?

Good point. I see a campaign coming on. My parents did the right thing by having me some decades ago, before the Government was subsidising this sort of behaviour with cash payments. Why should they not be treated on an equal basis with people who happen to have made this choice much later?

[mairteenpak]

Personally i would have thought the saving on fuel would be reward on its own right.

The doctrine of rewarding those who recently convert to greener ways while discriminating against those who made the move some time ago is contrary to Natural Justice.

The key issue is that the tax is levied on an annual basis at different levels for persons in the same circumstances with identical cars.

Were the State to levy different levels of income taxes on individuals with identical incomes and personal circumstances, simply on the basis of how long they had their particular job the Government would be laughed at.

Mr Gormley would probably argue that his scheme promotes a public benefit, of lower pollution levels. On the contrary his scheme is open anyone even those who are increasing the CO2 emissions of their vehicle, as it is not necessary to prove that you are opting for a vehicle of lower emissions.

For those who are reducing their CO2 emissions the lower fuel cost would have been a reward in its own right.

It was open to the Minister to re balance motor taxation on the basis such as would have achieved the original tax take while providing incentives by way of leveling taxes on cars on the basis of their emissions treating all cars of similar emissions in the same way as the tax is levied on an annual basis.

The scheme has undermined the value of existing low emission cars while increasing relatively the value of existing high emission vehicles.

The State can obviously take the personal circumstances of individuals into account when levying taxes, as such would be basis for taking from the rich to give to the poor. This tax has not been implemented at different levels for the purpose of securing the DIRECTIVE PRINCIPLES OF SOCIAL POLICY
as set out in Article 45 which would have been a just basis for treating people in differing circumstances differently.

[mairteenpak]

Everybody can't expect to benefit from every tax change. Should we pay the Early Childhood Supplement to everyone in the country given that at some stage in their lives they were under 6 years old?

Good point. I see a campaign coming on. My parents did the right thing by having me some decades ago, before the Government was subsidising this sort of behaviour with cash payments. Why should they not be treated on an equal basis with people who happen to have made this choice much later?

Different circumstanced pertained later

The Gormley tax charges different people in the same circumstances with the same car and the same emissions different sums in the same year.

[joemomma]

The Gormley tax charges different people in the same circumstances with the same car and the same emissions different sums in the same year.

What's the difference between me and a baby born in the last few years, other than the year we were born?