Equality - It's not gonna happen

[Pidge]

Each party pushes "equality" as one of their central tenets. But when they and others speak of equality, what do they mean?
Are they talking about the potentially achievable situation where everyone is given a fair start in life and are rewarded if they work hard/succeed and get supported at a low level if they don't?
Or are they actually trying to achieve a nation where everyone, regardless of initiave, work or success is given the same?

Do the parties mean anything when they mention "equality" or do they simply use it as a cheap buzzword?

[GusherING]

I agree, it's never gonna happen. Look what 'equality' has got us; bangardaí, lollypop men and male nurses.!!!

Ok while the last two can actually perform their jobs well, the first is incapable of trying to arrest any man under the influence of drink, rage or drugs, as well as carrying the standard chip on the shoulder of being a woman with, wait for it, "power".

Equality just leads to ************************ like this, woman being on the garda pay roll and so on. Its meaningless in terms of that and is just a buzzword, nonsensical, P.C policy. Equality in terms of where men and women should be equal such as voting, etc, is a worthwhile project, I may add.

As for redistributive equality, we don't need marxism and I don't think any Irish party in their right mind would actively promote such a radical and economically ill-thought out measure.

[stringjack]

Ok while the last two can actually perform their jobs well, the first is incapable of trying to arrest any man under the influence of drink, rage or drugs, as well as carrying the standard chip on the shoulder of being a woman with, wait for it, "power".

Equality just leads to s*** like this, woman being on the garda pay roll and so on. Its meaningless in terms of that and is just a buzzword, nonsensical, P.C policy.

Not everything a Guard does requires being able to make the arrests you describe, and anyway, there are some women capable of doing that. Do I really have to walk you through the advantages of having women in the Gardaí?

[borderlinegenius]

Ok while the last two can actually perform their jobs well, the first is incapable of trying to arrest any man under the influence of drink, rage or drugs, as well as carrying the standard chip on the shoulder of being a woman with, wait for it, "power".

Dude, this says a lot more about you than it does about female gardai.

[Pidge]

Ok while the last two can actually perform their jobs well, the first is incapable of trying to arrest any man under the influence of drink, rage or drugs, as well as carrying the standard chip on the shoulder of being a woman with, wait for it, "power".

Equality just leads to s*** like this, woman being on the garda pay roll and so on. Its meaningless in terms of that and is just a buzzword, nonsensical, P.C policy. Equality in terms of where men and women should be equal such as voting, etc, is a worthwhile project, I may add.

Ah! Thats not what I meant at all!

[borderlinegenius]

He was answering the question you were too polite to ask: 'Are women really silly little creatures who don't deserve the vote?'

Which I thought was quite generous of him.

[Pidge]

He was answering the question you were too polite to ask: 'Are women really silly little creatures who don't deserve the vote?'

Which I thought was quite generous of him.

Damn, you guys see right through me... a misogynistic question cunningly hidden in an economics-lite one. Good work guys

[GusherING]

Not everything a Guard does requires being able to make the arrests you describe, and anyway, there are some women capable of doing that. Do I really have to walk you through the advantages of having women in the Gardaí?

Obviously not. Admin and searching females in custody are two. However, my point still stands, it would be a lot harder for most women Gardai to arrest an unruly person, their physique, strength and experience at fighting someone, would as nature (and in the case of the latter, the school-yard) has it, be much lesser than a man. And while some women have the aforementioned characteristics, by no way at all are they all as capable as most males to make an arrest on a troublesome individual.

No I know your gonna say not all men are like that, but the weakest man is gonna be stronger than the weakest woman. Equality hides this difference with policies which ignore this fact, assuming on paper that all are equal. Which brings me to the conclusion, that specific female gardai aren't a great incentive to have at all, after all, police are meant to be on the streets stopping crime and patroling areas to make them safe. A womans lesser ability to physically threaten and stop someone if necessary, makes the case against them stronger I find.

Now just to ensure I'm not portrayed as a woman hating chavinist, I'll also argue for the case that men are unsuitable for jobs that women are specifically suited for, women again by nature, although again there are exceptions as in the above example, are more likely to be better at say, childcare or teaching. Why do you think these jobs are dominated by women, they have strengths in being able to be supportive, communicate well and care well for children. Many men are less able to do all of that.

This is a sort of gender stereotyping, of course,and there are exceptions to this, but to buy into the fact that all men and all women are completely equal and can do all of the same jobs equally well is complete rubbish. We make similar distinctions between rationality and general intellect in the Leaving Cert and every day as well. Why this norm should change in the name of equality, which is a nice idea btw, is irrational in itself. We should play to our strengths, not make some work to their weaknesses in the name of total equality.

[stringjack]

Obviously not. Admin and searching females in custody are two.

And dealing with female rape victims, victims of domestic violence etc. And canvassing witnesses. And investigating serious crime, organised crime and financial aspects of crime. And patrolling, which, contrary to your belief, can be done in the absence of the ability to singlehandedly subdue a violent offender.

However, my point still stands, it would be a lot harder for most women Gardai to arrest an unruly person, their physique, strength and experience at fighting someone, would as nature (and in the case of the latter, the school-yard) has it, be much lesser than a man. And while some women have the aforementioned characteristics, by no way at all are they all as capable as most males to make an arrest on a troublesome individual.

I didn't dispute that point, though I added that proper training can render a woman well able to deal with most (if not all) men.

Which brings me to the conclusion, that specific female gardai aren't a great incentive to have at all, after all, police are meant to be on the streets stopping crime and patroling areas to make them safe. A womans lesser ability to physically threaten and stop someone if necessary, makes the case against them stronger I find.

And if that's all that Gardaí did, you would have a strong point. It's not, so you don't, really.

Now just to ensure I'm not portrayed as a woman hating chavinist, I'll also argue for the case that men are unsuitable for jobs that women are specifically suited for, women again by nature, although again there are exceptions as in the above example, are more likely to be better at say, childcare or teaching. Why do you think these jobs are dominated by women, they have strengths in being able to be supportive, communicate well and care well for children. Many men are less able to do all of that.

I, and many others, would dispute most of that. Physical differences between the sexes are undeniable. Once you go beyond that, there's quite a lot more doubt as to how significant any differences are. And it's not a particularly new tactic to say that women have useful skills, so long as they stay in their proper place. Men have been saying that for ages.

We make similar distinctions between rationality and general intellect in the Leaving Cert and every day as well. Why this norm should change in the name of equality, which is a nice idea btw, is irrational in itself. We should play to our strengths, not make some work to their weaknesses in the name of total equality.

I'm not sure I have any idea what you're talking about.

[flakie]

http://www.ananova.com/news/story/sm...s.strangecrime

A properly trained woman is just as effective at self-defence as a properly trained man.