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  1. #1481
    petaljam petaljam is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by tonic View Post
    I have told you many times, but as is your way you pay no attention to answers preferring instead to run with your already preconceived bias.

    Practicality, it simply isn't practical to stop people traveling nor to prosecute for something that is legal both where the service is provided and in all our neighbouring countries,
    See, this why you're not credible : "practical" is irrelevant for something as serious as murder of innocent children, which is basically your only grounds for why you should have a say about someone else's pregnancy in the first place.

    It's not "practical" to try to put an end to child sex abuse, but that doesn't mean we should therefore allow people to do it openly, nor travel to do it abroad where it is legal and then come back and do stand up routines or write articles about their experiences. As has happened for abortion.

    Quote Originally Posted by tonic View Post
    even if practical it would be counter productive and self defeating.
    Well this is just another version of the first argument, so doesn't count.

    Quote Originally Posted by tonic View Post
    Our message is very clear, abortion is morally wrong, the unborn child does have a right to its life and you need the strongest of reasons to deny that right and "I'd rather not be pregnant" won't cut it.

    And as the numbers show, our message works.
    You keep telling yourself that, dear.
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  2. #1482
    petaljam petaljam is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sailor View Post
    I don't blame Livi for talking that meaning from my comment, but I do blame you for attempting to do so, considering I explained to you only a few weeks ago that that I am opposed to the present penal system, regard it as an expression of Victorian attitudes and that I oppose custodial sentences except in very limited circumstances, primarily for cases where society needs protection. And now we are finished with this off-topic excursion too.
    As I said, in the context of a discussion on penal reform, that would be a very good point. In the context of the current situation, it's completely nonsensical and the claim that it's a general view about crime not a particular one on abortion is nothing more than a dodge.

    Unless you're on record elsewhere as being interested in penal reform for all crimes of course. I'm sure you can point to the many threads on general penal reform where you've elaborated on this approach.
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  3. #1483
    Sailor Sailor is offline

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    I very much regret having to comment that this thread now stands as one of the low points of discussion on this site, with a number of posters relying entirely on abuse and false and irrelevant accusations to counter the views of those who favour a constitutional provision covering abortion.
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  4. #1484
    petaljam petaljam is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sailor View Post
    I never once referred to my daughter in that discussion - and the lie that I did was largely perpetrated by Emily and has now been picked up by Starry. But this is so far off topic as to be ridiculous and will not be discussed further.
    I can completely understand you not wanting to get into a personal discussion about your daughters' sexual history, genuinely. It is largely why I haven't really been picking up on this point. However you really do set yourself up for this sort of thing by being so judgmental of others. Just my own two cents of course.
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  5. #1485
    Sailor Sailor is offline

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    Quote Originally Posted by petaljam View Post
    I can completely understand you not wanting to get into a personal discussion about your daughters' sexual history, genuinely. It is largely why I haven't really been picking up on this point. However you really do set yourself up for this sort of thing by being so judgmental of others. Just my own two cents of course.
    I do not accept that mentioning that I have a daughter who is now 25 on some thread should be seen as setting myself up for having her associated with a comment about teenage contraception on some utterly unrelated thread.
    But I accept that you have not pursued the matter with the same glee and enthusiasm as others have.
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  6. #1486
    StarryPlough01 StarryPlough01 is offline
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    This is how far some people want to go -

    One poster wanted to prosecute those travelling abroad to obtain abortions. He wanted to put a 'provision in the Constitution defining the unborn as a citizen after 12 weeks' gestation.'

    He wanted to 'increase the maximum from 14 years to life for abortions that were then unlawful under Irish law beyond foetal viability.'
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  7. #1487
    StarryPlough01 StarryPlough01 is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sailor View Post
    I do not accept that mentioning that I have a daughter who is now 25 on some thread should be seen as setting myself up for having her associated with a comment about teenage contraception on some utterly unrelated thread.
    But I accept that you have not pursued the matter with the same glee and enthusiasm as others have.
    M'lud the inference is clearly there, and goes to credibility.
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  8. #1488
    petaljam petaljam is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sailor View Post
    I do not accept that mentioning that I have a daughter who is now 25 on some thread should be seen as setting myself up for having her associated with a comment about teenage contraception on some utterly unrelated thread.
    But I accept that you have not pursued the matter with the same glee and enthusiasm as others have.
    I didn't mean because you'd said her age - Romeo and Juliet prove that teen sex is not new, for one thing.

    I meant saying that people were "delusional" if they didn't all do something you felt they should do. It does rather beg the question about your own personal situation that's all.
    But someone saying that who didn't have children - or who didn't have daughters - would also IMO be setting themselves up for equally strong, albeit differently expressed, criticism.

    It's that authoritarian streak in you again - you really need to get a handle on that!
    (And that really is all I have to say on that.)
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  9. #1489
    Emily Davison Emily Davison is offline

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    Quote Originally Posted by tonic View Post
    I have told you many times, but as is your way you pay no attention to answers preferring instead to run with your already preconceived bias.

    Practicality, it simply isn't practical to stop people traveling nor to prosecute for something that is legal both where the service is provided and in all our neighbouring countries, even if practical it would be counter productive and self defeating.

    Our message is very clear, abortion is morally wrong, the unborn child does have a right to its life and you need the strongest of reasons to deny that right and "I'd rather not be pregnant" won't cut it.

    And as the numbers show, our message works.
    200,000 women shows different.
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  10. #1490
    Sailor Sailor is offline

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    Quote Originally Posted by petaljam View Post
    I didn't mean because you'd said her age - Romeo and Juliet prove that teen sex is not new, for one thing.

    I meant saying that people were "delusional" if they didn't all do something you felt they should do. It does rather beg the question about your own personal situation that's all.
    But someone saying that who didn't have children - or who didn't have daughters - would also IMO be setting themselves up for equally strong, albeit differently expressed, criticism.

    It's that authoritarian streak in you again - you really need to get a handle on that!
    Off-topic.
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