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About LinkBacksYeah I'll believe this when it's carried by the big media outlets. When it leads Channel 4 news. The Swedes aren't media giants.
Yeah I'll believe this when it's carried by the big media outlets. When it leads Channel 4 news. The Swedes aren't media giants.
"Unless you are an absolute pacifist, then you acknowledge that there are times when taking up arms is appropriate."
- cactusflower
When I visited a number of West Bank hospitals and spoke with dialysis patients in Bethlehem hospital in particular, they told me that their dialysis machines contributed by the West had been diverted to hospitals in Jerusalem used by Israelis instead.
Lengthy investigation proved eventually that this was indeed the case.
I don't have much problem believing that the Israelis would involuntarily harvest organs they need (and can't get anywhere else), given that they've been already caught out stealing medicines, and medical equipment from Palestinians and given that they routinely shoot up Palestinian ambulances.
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Tell that to the Swedish foreign ministry spokeman:Originally Posted by Eldritch
This is about the verasity of the story, not criticism of the Israelis. Those who refuse to question the story (which pops up only after the New Jersey affair) are buying into it because it slanders Jews or they are a bit thick."In a democratic country, there should be no place for dark blood libels out of the Middle Ages of this type," Palmor said. "This is an article that shames Swedish democracy and the entire Swedish press."
I am reminded of a simular story of Kosovans harvesting Serbian organs during the Serbs assault on Kosovo. Made Serbian national news and prompted a national inquiry in Serbia. Where did that inquiry lead? A few years later... nowhere. The hysteria and hate mongering served its purpose - that facts of the made up case, as ever, are irrelivent.
Oh come on, I don't usually bother getting involved in this debate but that is utter neo-colonial hogwash. the same thing the boers said about the whole of south africa; practically virgin land. Europeans didn't need much of a sop to conscience in the 19th century to invade and subjugate a nation before morning tea, this was adequate.HTML Code:The arabs are not natives; reports from the 19th century clearly show that Israel was more or less deserted. Also what about the Jews that were driven out of Arab countries and oppressed by muslims for centuries?
The middle east is now and has been overcrowded for a very long time. especially coastal and arable areas.
who would believe that except that they pretend to for their own conscience sake.
as for the other tired arguments...
For the other accusation about organ harvesting. I would need to see strong evidence first but worse things happen when you dehumanise a people to more effectively fight them and destroy their credibility.
You are incorrect to imply that the story of Serbs being butcherd for their organs is not being taken seriously. The eminent lawyer Carla Del Ponte who headed investigations in Yugoslavia and Rwanda has given credence to the claims
Currently the council of Europe has sent Dick Marty, a Swiss investigator to Albania to investigate the claims. The Associated Press: EU probing alleged Balkan organ trafficking
Media reports indicate the Albanians are desperately stonewalling the investigation.
The organs of 300 to 500 people would have been worth in excess of $100m on the black market.
Why would the size of a media outlet determine how credible it is?
Fox News in the US isnt known for honest reportage yet its enormous - Rupert Murdoch is doing his level best to destroy the last remaining shread of credibility that traditional journalists have.
I'd love to pour scorn on this report, sometimes I feel that some publications do actually have an anti-semitic agenda, but there is a huge difference between anti-Israeli and and anti-Jewish (lets not get into idiot semantics about the word 'semite').
I know plenty of anti-Israeli state, I no absolutely no-one who is anti-Jewish.
I admit the story seems somewhat wild and hard to believe, but its certainly not impossible nor even implausible. If the IDF have no problem with shooting at civilians, stealing their organs is hardly going to be an issue.
As is, I am going to take this report with a pinch of salt, simply because there isnt any hard evidence, not for any perceived bias towards one or the other side in this dispute.
If I could mass-sterilise the planet, I would. Seriously.
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Carla Del Ponte said in her book that she found no proof of the alledged crimes, but thought there was something to the story - again based on her hunch as opposed to actual proof. She was roundly comdemned for making such a wreckless statement.
And Dick Marty is going to find proof how? By talking to the government making claims and government assused. What will that add to the zero proof that exists? Zero. It is and remains an allegation. It would not be the first time Serbias economy with the truth has wasted resources. One of the main cases against Anton Gotovina, a Croatian General, fell apart on the witness stand in the Hague. Years of work down the pan because UN eye witnesses, where basing their evidance not on what they "witnessed with their own eyes" (!?!?!) but on Serbian hearsay and claims from Knin.
All war crime allegations in the Balkans should perhaps be investigated publically and by figures whose careers will suffer if the truth is not transparent. Then the liers as well as the true victims will be exposed. Dick Marty will not be eager to see his reputation and credability take a knock like Del Ponte gifted herself.
Last edited by Thac0man; 19th August 2009 at 04:09 PM.
Used to be that people beleived that Jews killed Christian children in ritual ceremonies to drink their blood. Common beleif here up to the 20s. This stuff is from same stable. Interesting you say that it is a 'left leaning' newspaper as if that lends it credabiility! Anti semitism is common among the left, usually thinnly disguised as 'anti Zionism' but of course the same characters do not work themselves up into a paroxysm over other regimes in the region like Syria and Iran which of course unlike Israel regualrly murder and torture leftist opponents.
Maybe the leftie fascist who neg repped me on this could point out any of the alleged inaccuracies in my post? Mmmmmmm, too much to expect I suppose.
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