Israeli soldiers' "cold blooded murder" of Gaza's civilians

[kintama]

Yet again, the violence was initiated (as was well demonstrated) an still is by the so called "Palestinian" Arab leadership, which is profoundly in the thought that they can, with the help of the Islamofascist and the European Left (including a substantial Irish support), bring the demise of Israel.

They never stopped this, before 1967 and after 1967. That means, for those hollow-brained of posters here, that neither settlements nor Jerusalem are the reason for their hatred, they don't really even want a two-state solution, what they really want is one big "Palestine". And on the account of the Jews in Israel.

If someone really wants to resolve the problem, one should be realistic about the pragmatic situation, and frankly, there isn't anyone here who's even near it.

Slaughtering children to create facts on the ground does not lend itself to the 'pragmatic solution' you espouse which in code means accept what the 'master race' are prepared to give. I for one will accept a just two state solution, you and your murderous friends only want a solution that cannot and will not be acceptable to the dispossessed.

You can peddle all the lies you want but the violence was initiated by your leadership with one eye on the elections (don't believe me check you own military sources) and your Nazi 'IDF' monsters left toddlers to starve almost to the point of death. But the Embassy don't want to talk about that .
It is the fascist behaviour of the Zionists that will bring about the demise of the Israeli state, as currently constituted, and no one on this site will be silenced by your patronising analysis.

[L'Chaim]

You're just not getting it, L'Chaim.

You want to catch me up in your tautology, and I am not going to bite.

I already told you that a truly constructive and realistic alternative should not be discussed openly in the early stages but needs to be sent through to the appropriate channels.... and yet I am faulted for not posting such suggestions.

Such suggestions, by the way, do not and in fact should not come in the form of a few sentences, but instead come in the form of a large document which demonstrates how, for example, Suggestions A and B will integrate well with Suggestions B and C and also withwhat might already be in place on the ground. Overly simplistic single-sentence "solutions" are not solutions at all. I might well indeed have some very realistic alternatives, but they are certainly not for YOUR eyes nor for the eyes of anyone reading this board.

But more than anything, L'Chaim, I have given you some very serious clues about where I am coming from, and it is clear they have gone right past you. All the subtle hints have zipped right by you. So that tells me a lot about you and your level of involvement and experience. Also, your knowledge is extremely limited. You need to go do more homework. You don't know what you are talking about.

You have no idea how much you don't know.

So please, stay that way. DON'T read, DON'T do any research, but please do continue to use the same tired, worn out, unconstructive thinking. It will help to prolong this for another 50+ years. That will be your legacy.

(just saw your advice: "stopping the violence", which according to you is all in the hands of Palestinian militants. This is exactly what I mean about you being overly-simplistic and grossly under-informed. You really need to get out more)

You think I'm being "overly-simplistic"? That's a laugh. You're the one who claims that Israeli security measures are to blame for strengthening Islamic extremist support among the Palestinians. That's not only 'overly-simplistic' but a very lazy analysis too. You don't see that Israel is caught between a rock and a hard place here and you don't take on board that for any sovereign state the protection of its citizens is paramount. When it comes to people like you the palestinian militants are in a win-win situation. They attack Israel and Israel has two choices. Either they violate their own morality by going after the terrorists and inevitably killing some civilians the terrorists place in harm's way, or else they maintain their morality and leave the terrorists a free hand to target Israeli civilians. It's a lose-lose situation for Israel and a win-win situation for Hamas. Because when it comes to people like you, no matter what Israel does you will blame them. You will blame them as being the reason for the attacks on their own civilians or you will blame them for responding to those attacks.

What you're trying to do is to establish a moral equivalency between those who perpetrate violence and those who react to it. That's why you can't give any realistic alternatives (despite being asked twice or three times) to Israeli security measures put in place to protect its own civilians. You don't want to see that Israel is not perpetrating a cycle of violence, but is trying to protect its citizens and end the violence by going after the terrorists who are carrying it out. Now nobody disputes that the palestinians are suffering oppression, but the ones carrying out that oppression are their own leaders and the countries that support their acts of terror against israel, like Iran and Syria. And when palestinians get their own independent Palestinian state they will continue to be oppressed, just like most Arabs are, by their own leaders. And the palestinians will continue to live under a repressive regime run by a corrupt dictatorship. And even then they'll blame Israel for their plight. And people like you will too.

[loaded32]

Yet again, the violence was initiated (as was well demonstrated) an still is by the so called "Palestinian" Arab leadership, which is profoundly in the thought that they can, with the help of the Islamofascist and the European Left (including a substantial Irish support), bring the demise of Israel.

They never stopped this, before 1967 and after 1967. That means, for those hollow-brained of posters here, that neither settlements nor Jerusalem are the reason for their hatred, they don't really even want a two-state solution, what they really want is one big "Palestine". And on the account of the Jews in Israel.

If someone really wants to resolve the problem, one should be realistic about the pragmatic situation, and frankly, there isn't anyone here who's even near it.

Yanshuf, your above qoute and very many others are quite hypocrticical when you are slagging off the common Irish support for the Palestinian cause while also using our native language as a sign off on your posts! Do you not think that in itself is hypocritical, then added to the fact that we irish people and our land is still under occupation!?

Does it not "twig" with you, given our history of supression and occupation, that the plight of the Palestinian people would strike a chord with Irish people! You are also the same person who accused someone earliler in this thread of being anti-semitic, which proved also that you dont even know what a semite is!

At the end of the day yanshuf, the facts remain that with the bully-style backing of UK&USA, the jewish people took illegal advantage of "loopholes" in the Palestine common-land laws to oust them from their land and drive them into 2 enclaves where you can control and further suppress them. The fact remains that the current borders of the self proclaimed state of Israel contravene the borders set up by the UN even!

[kintama]

You think I'm being "overly-simplistic"? That's a laugh. You're the one who claims that Israeli security measures are to blame for strengthening Islamic extremist support among the Palestinians. That's not only 'overly-simplistic' but a very lazy analysis too. You don't see that Israel is caught between a rock and a hard place here and you don't take on board that for any sovereign state the protection of its citizens is paramount. When it comes to people like you the palestinian militants are in a win-win situation. They attack Israel and Israel has two choices. Either they violate their own morality by going after the terrorists and inevitably killing some civilians the terrorists place in harm's way, or else they maintain their morality and leave the terrorists a free hand to target Israeli civilians. It's a lose-lose situation for Israel and a win-win situation for Hamas. Because when it comes to people like you, no matter what Israel does you will blame them. You will blame them as being the reason for the attacks on their own civilians or you will blame them for responding to those attacks.

What you're trying to do is to establish a moral equivalency between those who perpetrate violence and those who react to it. That's why you can't give any realistic alternatives (despite being asked twice or three times) to Israeli security measures put in place to protect its own civilians. You don't want to see that Israel is not perpetrating a cycle of violence, but is trying to protect its citizens and end the violence by going after the terrorists who are carrying it out. Now nobody disputes that the palestinians are suffering oppression, but the ones carrying out that oppression are their own leaders and the countries that support their acts of terror against israel, like Iran and Syria. And when palestinians get their own independent Palestinian state they will continue to be oppressed, just like most Arabs are, by their own leaders. And the palestinians will continue to live under a repressive regime run by a corrupt dictatorship. And even then they'll blame Israel for their plight. And people like you will too.

Protect it's own civilians you are having a laugh. If Israel was genuinely interested in protecting its citizens it would not have launched an attack on Gaza that ended the ceasefire (which was protecting its citizens). Still nothing from the Embassy on the toddlers left to starve almost to the point of death you and your kind have no right to talk about moral equivalency.

[Alterego]

The Palestinians have two choices: either they violate their own morality by going after the illegal occupiers of their land and inevitably killing some civilians the Zionist leadership has placed on occupied land and therefore in harm's way, or else they maintain their morality and leave the occupiers a free hand to enlarge their illegal settlements, continue the expulsion of the indigineous Arab population and target Palestinian civilians. It's a lose-lose situation for the Palestinians and a win-win situation for Jewish Zionists. Because when it comes to people like you L'Chaim, no matter what the Palestinians do you will blame them. You will blame them as being the reason for the attacks on their own civilians or you will blame them for responding to those attacks.

[loaded32]

The Palestinians have two choices: either they violate their own morality by going after the illegal occupiers of their land and inevitably killing some civilians the Zionist leadership has placed on occupied land and therefore in harm's way, or else they maintain their morality and leave the occupiers a free hand to enlarge their illegal settlements, continue the expulsion of the indigineous Arab population and target Palestinian civilians. It's a lose-lose situation for the Palestinians and a win-win situation for Jewish Zionists. Because when it comes to people like you L'Chaim, no matter what the Palestinians do you will blame them. You will blame them as being the reason for the attacks on their own civilians or you will blame them for responding to those attacks.

Exactly AE, so essentially they dont realy have a choice at all, do they! I wonder if Yanshuf, with his Gaelige sign off's, would consider the North to be Ireland or UK ????

"Israel" cannot obtain legal title to any territory by conquest. Thus Israel's borders were legally established by the United Nations Partition Resolution of 1947, which ended Great Britain's power as a trustee on condition that an Arab State and a Jewish State would be established with borders as demarkated in the text of the resolution. Those borders remain the legal boundary of the ilegal "State" of Israel.

[L'Chaim]

The Palestinians have two choices: either they violate their own morality by going after the illegal occupiers of their land and inevitably killing some civilians the Zionist leadership has placed on occupied land and therefore in harm's way, or else they maintain their morality and leave the occupiers a free hand to enlarge their illegal settlements, continue the expulsion of the indigineous Arab population and target Palestinian civilians. It's a lose-lose situation for the Palestinians and a win-win situation for Jewish Zionists. Because when it comes to people like you L'Chaim, no matter what the Palestinians do you will blame them. You will blame them as being the reason for the attacks on their own civilians or you will blame them for responding to those attacks.

I thought I was reading my own post for a moment but then saw you had just used my post from another thread and swapped a few things around. But that's exactly what enemies of Israel do all the time. They try and hi-jack Jewish thoughts and events and ideas. It's nothing new, to take a Jewish post and try to pawn it off as your own idea. Kids in an exam would be disqualified for that.

[Alterego]

I thought I was reading my own post for a moment but then saw you had just used my post from another thread and swapped a few things around. But that's exactly what enemies of Israel do all the time. They try and hi-jack Jewish thoughts and events and ideas. It's nothing new, to take a Jewish post and try to pawn it off as your own idea. Kids in an exam would be disqualified for that.

Your original post is but two posts up, it doesn't take a genius to see that all I did was swap a few names etc. That of course shows the absurdity of your argument, and that through a simple change of name one can see the real truth. By the way, laying claim to what you have posted as being your own is rather disingenuous - don't you think? I could show you any number of posts where you have simply cut and paste statements that you obviously retain on your computer.

[L'Chaim]

Your original post is but two posts up, it doesn't take a genius to see that all I did was swap a few names etc. That of course shows the absurdity of your argument, and that through a simple change of name one can see the real truth. By the way, laying claim to what you have posted as being your own is rather disingenuous - don't you think? I could show you any number of posts where you have simply cut and paste statements that you obviously retain on your computer.

But by "swapping a few names" does not make something the truth. That's distorting the truth. And distorting the truth is a lie. Your whole argument is based in distorting the truth and lies.

[Alterego]

But by "swapping a few names" does not make something the truth. That's distorting the truth. And distorting the truth is a lie. Your whole argument is based in distorting the truth and lies.

Now we're getting somewhere, changing history does not make it truth either. What you have done is distort the truth and distorting the truth is a lie. Your whole existence is based on distorting the truth.