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  1. #1011
    Hillmanhunter1 Hillmanhunter1 is online now
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    Quote Originally Posted by L'Chaim View Post
    I quite agree. And Israel isn't!
    Israel is not a theocracy, true, but it is a Jewish State, run in the main by and for the benefit of Jews. The fact that it is not led by rabbis does not make it a normal secular state.

    In this regard it is just like Saudi Arabia, which is also not a theocracy (it is a monarchy) but it is a Muslim State run in the main by and for the benefit of Wahabbi Muslims.
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  2. #1012
    Catalpast Catalpast is offline
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    former British army barracks likely to house the US embassy in Jerusalem

    US embassy in Jerusalem is likely to be built on what is today a muddy field on the site of a former British army barracks.á
    Ever since 1989, when theáIsraeli-Palestinian peace process began to gather steam, the US government has leased a plot of land from Israel for just $1.á

    The former British army barracks likely to house the US embassy in Jerusalem

    This has been in the pipeline for years....
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  3. #1013
    owedtojoy owedtojoy is online now
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hillmanhunter1 View Post
    There is a direct comparison to be made, the displacement by use of violence of indigenous people to make way for a new ruling class.

    It is a lie to deny that Israel is a creation of European Jews, and is now maintained principally by the influence and money of American Jews.

    Given that I live in (and worship as a Christian) in an Islamic country means that I am aware of how welcoming Islamic countries are to alien cultures - more so than you, clearly!
    It would be entirely accurate to call Israel Europe's last colony, with additional colonists from other parts of the world, but mostly from Europe, including Russia.

    It is now self-governing, and viable. I support its continuance within borders freely agreed with the Palestinians, and any other conditions like compensation for displaced people.

    Much has been made of President Harry Truman recognising it 70 years ago - less has been made of the fact that Joseph Stalin recognised it almost simultaneously. Stalin soon went off his step-child, when he found that "socialist" Israel was not pro-Russian.
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  4. #1014
    Trainwreck Trainwreck is offline

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    Did you say the Arab League?

    The Pope? FFS. (queue monty python skit "watery tarts handing out swords isn't a valid system of government")

    Macron?



    Jesus, good look with that motley gaggle son.



    A small tip. When "the great and the good" proclaim something, tilt naturally to the contrary view. It is Occum's other razor.
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  5. #1015
    valamhic valamhic is offline

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    There are Trump haters over onnthe Trump gets caught thread (I am banned) claiming Trump has done nothing whatsoever since becoming president. Well, he has done this, hasn't he?
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  6. #1016
    Trainwreck Trainwreck is offline

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    Just f˙cking look at what Trump has started now! This is unconscionable!


    https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/...06911629869056
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  7. #1017
    leftsoc leftsoc is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by owedtojoy View Post
    It would be entirely accurate to call Israel Europe's last colony, with additional colonists from other parts of the world, but mostly from Europe, including Russia.

    It is now self-governing, and viable. I support its continuance within borders freely agreed with the Palestinians, and any other conditions like compensation for displaced people.

    Much has been made of President Harry Truman recognising it 70 years ago - less has been made of the fact that Joseph Stalin recognised it almost simultaneously. Stalin soon went off his step-child, when he found that "socialist" Israel was not pro-Russian.
    There was a case for a homeland for Jews after the war.siince the crimes against them were by europe and christendom it should have been carved out in europe out of land taken from those who committed the crimes ie land abanoned by germans fleeing west to their homeland and in ukraine. Somewhere the ashkenasi jews always lived.

    Readers will laugh at the impracticality of this.you cant just. Take land from historic peoples and expect no future retribution! But isnt that just what was done to the Palestinians, who had nothing to with european fascism'crimes against the Jews?
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  8. #1018
    Trainwreck Trainwreck is offline

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    Quote Originally Posted by valamhic View Post
    There are Trump haters over onnthe Trump gets caught thread (I am banned) claiming Trump has done nothing whatsoever since becoming president. Well, he has done this, hasn't he?
    There are two supposed "outrages" the usual Libtards are taking from this:


    1. That Trump declared Jerusalem to be capital of Israel and that it should not be divided.
    2. That he will move the US embassy to Jerusalem (will, as in intends to) - which of course is an imperative if you believe it is the capital.



    But:

    Clinton, Bush and Obama before him used almost identical words and equal conviction in declaring that Jerusalem was Israel's capital. If anything they were more forthright than Trump. Yet all three failed to move the embassy there and all three failed to follow through in any way on their explicitly articulated beliefs and conviction.


    It is still yet to be confirmed whether the US embassy actually does get moved. But the rage here and everywhere else is premised on a belief that Trump will deliver on the promise (when Obama, Bush and Clinton failed. Failed).



    So what do we have? This is what we have:

    Moral outrage that Trump would declare exactly the same thing that Obama, Bush and Clinton before him declared and was agreed in Congress by massive majority. In essence - this has been America's unambiguous position for decades, affirmed by virtually the entire body of elected representatives of the population. Meaning: Your Libtard rage is at Americans almost universally, including Obama - not Trump.

    Secondly - and this is bizarre - your Libtard rage is in fact based on a belief that Trump will deliver on what he promised the electorate, where Clinton, Bush and Obama promised very clearly, but reneged. In Libtard rage world, delivering on your promises to the electorate is baaaad. Reneging is angelic. How demented is that?


    FFS, this is nuts beyond anything we have seen. And I pin it on the fact that Trump is delivering on everything he promised. And those Leftie Libtard are just seething and running out of road.
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  9. #1019
    owedtojoy owedtojoy is online now
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    Quote Originally Posted by leftsoc View Post
    There was a case for a homeland for Jews after the war.siince the crimes against them were by europe and christendom it should have been carved out in europe out of land taken from those who committed the crimes ie land abanoned by germans fleeing west to their homeland and in ukraine. Somewhere the ashkenasi jews always lived.

    Readers will laugh at the impracticality of this.you cant just. Take land from historic peoples and expect no future retribution! But isnt that just what was done to the Palestinians, who had nothing to with european fascism'crimes against the Jews?
    In the aftermath of the shock and horror of the Holocaust, Israel was the "natural" place to go, it is where the fleeing European Jews themselves chose to go. Countries (including Ireland and the US) had shut them out in the 1930s, deadly anti-Semitism still prevailed in places like Poland, Ukraine and Russia, so there seemed no other option.

    The Palestinians were the scapegoats for evils perpetrated mainly by Europeans - not the last time indigenous brown people were made to suffer in that role. In all Zionist plans, ethnic cleansing was always an option, and as soon as the chance became available, it was taken. Israel was created just like modern South Africa, Australia, Brazil, or the US itself were ... by stealing land from the original inhabitants who has lived there for centuries.

    Those are the "facts on the ground", and they cannot be changed, no more than Greeks driven out of Turkey in 1922 could return, or Germans driven out of Silesia or East Prussia in 1945 could return home.

    The world is often a brutal place, and palliation/ mitigation/ redemption is sometimes all that can be offered. But that is not what Trump or Netanyahu is offering - the Palestinians are still being punished for being non-white and weak.
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  10. #1020
    roc_ roc_ is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by leftsoc View Post
    There was a case for a homeland for Jews after the war.siince the crimes against them were by europe and christendom it should have been carved out in europe out of land taken from those who committed the crimes ie land abanoned by germans fleeing west to their homeland and in ukraine. Somewhere the ashkenasi jews always lived.

    Readers will laugh at the impracticality of this.you cant just. Take land from historic peoples and expect no future retribution! But isnt that just what was done to the Palestinians, who had nothing to with european fascism'crimes against the Jews?
    There was also a case for it at the turn of the nineteenth century when such as our own Michael Davitt argued strongly for Zionism. - Within the Pale, the Story of Anti-Semitic Persecutions in Russia by Michael Davitt, 1903 .

    Practically every actively thinking person held that Zionism was moral and just, at the beginning of Zionism. (Read the link in my signature to get a better appreciation of the land question and regional choice made for repatriation, and why there was little concern expressed about displacement of the indigenous Arabs etc.).

    And you are right, the case was re-emphasised after the war. (But it was actually re-emphasized a number of times between when Davitt took the public stage to argue for Zionism, and then. https://www.simpletoremember.com/art...shPersecution/)

    And today, it is certainly emphasised too.- You only have to read between the lines of a multitude of contributors on this very thread. - OR, if you want to hear it said overtly, you don't need to go far. e.g.




    Indeed you could never say that ordinary Palestinians had anything to do with European fascism' crimes against the Jews. But their perpetually degenerate leadership certainly did.
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