Pat Tillman, American hero or another American victim?.

[}IknowurbutwhatamI{]

When Pat Tillman was killed in Afghanistan G.W Bush and the US regime wasted no time in using his "heroic" death to feed their propaganda machine. It now emerges that Tillman was killed/murdered by his own side

See here:http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/liv...n_page_id=1770

[Tommy Tayto]

Hmmm just found this thread now. Interesting piece, it fails to mention that Tillman's uniform and body armour were burned almost immediately. How very strange.....judging by the evidence and repeated story changing, something very sinister did take place. The question now is who ordered it?

[SonnyLaymatina]

Hmmm just found this thread now. Interesting piece, it fails to mention that Tillman's uniform and body armour were burned almost immediately. How very strange.....judging by the evidence and repeated story changing, something very sinister did take place. The question now is who ordered it?

But it's standard operating procedure in the US Army to informally train infantry soldiers to frag (kill) their incompetant commanding officers who keep engaging in unnecessary dangerous stunts for their own vain glory. But the soldiers must complete the mission. That is, they can't kill their C.O. and then retreat, they must fight on...which is what Tilman's men did after they killed him. I was talking to a fellow last week who is a Vietnam Veteran and we were talking about this very subject of Pat Tilman, and this guy told me that he also suspected Tilman was taken out by his own men because they completed the mission and the Army covered up what they did. When I asked him if he thought that was a good policy for the Army to informally have he said: "Everyone including Tilman knew the score. Moreover, it was also S.O.P. to warn the C.O. prior to killing him by anonymously rolling an unpulled grenade into his tent, and most C.O.'s got the message loud and clear and the ones that didn't...well f**k them, their Mothers got a hero letter." By the way, this fellow has a PhD and teaches leadership courses at an American university.

[Tommy Tayto]

What CO are you talking about here? I'm aware of concept of fragging, it happened quite a lot in Vietnam. Tillman wasn't an officer was he?

Edit: Just noticed you posted on the Calley/My Lai thread, I presume that was where it was intended for.

[SonnyLaymatina]

What CO are you talking about here? I'm aware of concept of fragging, it happened quite a lot in Vietnam. Tillman wasn't an officer was he?

Edit: Just noticed you posted on the Calley/My Lai thread, I presume that was where it was intended for.

I mistakenly thought he was a 2nd Lieutenent because he was a graduate of Arizona State, and usually people with degrees get officer commissions. Turns out Tillman enlisted and was a Corporal which meant he had command authority over Privates only which is probably who killed him with three shots to his head.

[Destiny's Soldier]

1. Pat Tillman dies. Medical examiners request a fratricide investigation sometime thereafter. Their request is denied.

2. Gen. McChrystal sends a cable to Gen. Abizaid and another general on April 22 urging them to notify the President of this probable fratricide "in order to preclude any unknowing statements by our country's leaders which might cause embarrassment if the circumstances of Cpl. Tillman's death becomes public."

3. Gen.Abizaid claims he didn't receive it for 10 or 12 days, because he was in Iraq. (They don't have email, or even secure pouches for urgent memos?) Defense Department records later show that Gen. Abizaid was not in Iraq, but was actually in Qatar and Afghanistan - where the killing occurred - during that 10 to 12 days.

4. Gen. Myers learns the true nature of Cpl. Tillman's death in late April, yet - according to his testimony - did not feel the need to inform either the Secretary of Defense or the President.

5. Military records show that dozens of officers knew of the true nature of the Lieutenant's death within days, yet senior officers and Pentagon officials still maintain they didn't know for weeks. (Surprisingly, they did not undertake a massive review of military procedures in order to determine how such a massive series of communications failures could occur - one that eerily affected every single senior officer with responsibility for this case simultaneously.)

6. The military continues to press the story that Tillman was killed while courageously leading a counterattack in an Afghan mountain pass. (Nice poetic touch, that "mountain pass" - good for recruitment.)

7. A national memorial service is held for Cpl Tillman several days later. The President and others talk about Cpl. Tillmans heroism in that mythical mountain pass - yet Gen. Myers, per his own testimony, still felt no need to inform either the SecDef or the President .

8. Rumsfeld says he was not told the truth until "some time after May 20," or approximately a month after Gen. Myers learned of the incident. Yet he seems strangely undisturbed to learn that the truth was known six weeks earlier and he wasn't informed.

9. Neither Rumsfeld nor the President felt the need to correct the record publicly upon learning the truth.

10. It wasn't until reporters filed a Freedom of Information Act that the following information became public on July 27: ""Army medical examiners were suspicious about the close proximity of the three bullet holes in Pat Tillman's forehead and tried without success to get authorities to investigate whether the former NFL player's death amounted to a crime."

Let's say it again, to be very clear: The White House and Pentagon withheld the facts about this killing until they were legally forced to reveal them months later by Freedom of Information laws. And they never ordered a criminal investigation.

As for the testimony by Myers and Rumsfeld: What they have described is a command structure that was brutally indifferent to the situation on the ground and uninterested in pursuing a murder. Gen. Myers, if he is to be believed, allowed the President and Secretary of Defense to pay tribute to a man as if he had died in combat, knowing full well their words were untrue.

Is that plausible, with everything we know about Rumsfeld? Remember, this is the micromanager who hectored generals on little details, arrogantly told them he knew more than they did about the military, and issued regular memos to a wide range of Pentagon personnel on a variety of topics, great and small.

We are also supposed to believe that Rumsfeld was so uninvolved in the human issues his troops faced that he wasn't informed of the facts on this case - and that once he found out, he was unconcerned about the delay in telling him the facts. And that the President wasn't disturbed enough to order an investigation into the killing. Nor did he or Rumsfeld inform the family, or the nation, that they had been misled - at a hero's funeral.

As the conservatives used to say in the 90's: Character matters. And that's if they're telling the truth ... Can you imagine what we could learn about their character if, as is very possible, they're still lying?

[jpc]

It was a blue on blue.
Bad luck but it happens.

[PigPus the Truthteller]

Pat Tillman was killed on orders from high.

He was shot from very close range of about 25 meters, other wise the 3 bullets could not have been so tightly grouped. Nobody in the entire US Army would not know who he was and what he looked like. He was an NFL player who gave it all up to enlist and was viewed by all as a hero.

To have him become an anti-war advocate was not to be allowed

[Tommy Tayto]

It was a blue on blue.
Bad luck but it happens.

Yes, a deliberate blue on blue judging by the evidence we have so far.

[hopper]

silly boy - he could have made millions playing sport but the machine tricked him, he became the machine and the machine killed him and spat him out