Hamid Karzai on why the U.S. occupies his country

[ifreannach]

Al Qaeda yes, the Taliban are not going away any time soon. I refer you to my origional post on the subject here. As for your claims about heroin, perhaps you better explain you point and stop hinting at it in a nudge nudge wink wink kind of way.

rofl, my my my have you not been reading my unopinionated posts on the matter relating to to eradication of the poppy under the taliban and the reemergence of the poppy after the invasion or maybe you have realised that ******************** there were no afghanis involved in 911

Toland - go back to sleep

[Border-Rat]

Al Qaeda yes,

the Taliban are not going away any time soon. I refer you to my origional post on the subject here. As for your claims about heroin, perhaps you better explain you point and stop hinting at it in a nudge nudge wink wink kind of way.

I thought it was obvious, which is why I thought there wasn't a need to expand. But then again, I'm dealing with someone so spectacularly stupid as to believe the USA is in Afghanistan over terrorism.

I am layig a trap for you here. I may aswell tell you now as you are probably too stupid to see it anyway.

Oh, a trap is it?

[Thac0man]

Oh, a trap is it?

Yes you gobsh*te. Explain how the UN cites areas under Taliban control as being the main source of Heroin production in Afghanistan and how the Taliban can level a 20% tax on production aswell. Answers? Yes?

To get you started here are some FACTS. You needs some as you obviously have NONE:

From the UN drugs control agency (pretend this is crayon, might make it easier for you to grasp):


Why are all the main areas of Taliban activity also the largest areas of opium cultivation?

Now during the period of Taliban control you would like to refer to, can you provide proof that opium production did in fact fall? I mean actual factual proof, not the brain dead crap that through repetition still has no grounds for actually being true.

Now put you crayon goggles back on and look at this, again sourced from the UN statistics:



Pre 9/11 and US involvement Opium production under the Taliban actually hit a (then) historic high. Increasing by over 2000 metric tons in one year. Explain that, please.

The Taliban are and have been up to their balls in the opium trade. Afghan government officials and warlords at it too? Most definitely. The 2001 sharp decline coincided with the US invasion, it was not due to Taliban activity, actually it was due to lack of it.

So yes, it was a trap and you stumpled into it babbling nonsense, well done.

[Border-Rat]

Yes you gobsh*te. Explain how the UN cites areas under Taliban control as being the main source of Heroin production in Afghanistan and how the Taliban can level a 20% tax on production aswell. Answers? Yes?

To get you started here are some FACTS. You needs some as you obviously have NONE:

From the UN drugs control agency (pretend this is crayon, might make it easier for you to grasp):


Why are all the main areas of Taliban activity also the largest areas of opium cultivation?

Nice try. But these are not areas completely under 'Taliban control', they are areas deemed 'security risk extreme';



From the above, Poppy nerve centres:

- Helmand
- Kandahar
- Zabul

And now ISAF Deployments;



From the above, ISAF nerve centres:

- Helmand
- Kandahar
- Zabul

Now, is there a tingling occurring within your feeble grey matter? Look closely at both maps again. Go on, you can do it (But don't strain yourself, mind). Think, thacoman... think, you can do it.... Got it? I knew you could.

Now during the period of Taliban control you would like to refer to, can you provide proof that opium production did in fact fall? I mean actual factual proof, not the brain dead crap that through repetition still has no grounds for actually being true.

Now put you crayon goggles back on and look at this, again sourced from the UN statistics:



Pre 9/11 and US involvement Opium production under the Taliban actually hit a (then) historic high. Increasing by over 2000 metric tons in one year. Explain that, please.

The Taliban are and have been up to their balls in the opium trade. Afghan government officials and warlords at it too? Most definitely. The 2001 sharp decline coincided with the US invasion, it was not due to Taliban activity, actually it was due to lack of it.

So yes, it was a trap and you stumpled into it babbling nonsense, well done.

The drop in 2001 is not due to the invasion, the drop was on account of a ban instigated by Mohammed Omar beginning in July 2000 citing the action being unIslamic.

cannabisnews.com: Taliban To Lift Ban on Farmers Growing Opium

[Thac0man]

You seem entirely to have missed the news rat. NATO has undertaken a huge offensive in the areas where the Taliban are at their strongest, and coincidently Opium production is at its highest. Those two things are linked.

Opium seeds do not grow on trees. In 2001 with a US offensive looming the Taliban basically had the next harest delayed rather then possibly destroyed. They still level a tax (or 'Zakat') on the trade and enforce its growth in areas they control. How is that in keeping with the practive being 'unislamic'? Its not. So what Mulah Omar said in 2001 is nonsense, he is still very much alive and running an organistion whose main income is from opiom farming.

By your logic Opoium should be at a production of nearly nil in Taliban strongholds. Yet the facts prove that is not the case, actually the opposite.

You are peddling tired old crap and it is still as full of holes as it ever was.

[Border-Rat]

You seem entirely to have missed the news rat. NATO has undertaken a huge offensive in the areas where the Taliban are at their strongest, and coincidently Opium production is at its highest. Those two things are linked.

Well, yes... hello?

Opium seeds do not grow on trees. In 2001 with a US offensive looming the Taliban basically had the next harest delayed rather then possibly destroyed. They still level a tax (or 'Zakat') on the trade and enforce its growth in areas they control. How is that in keeping with the practive being 'unislamic'? Its not. So what Mulah Omar said in 2001 is nonsense, he is still very much alive and running an organistion whose main income is from opiom farming.

No. I have already proven that the ban was instigated by the leader of the Country in June 2000. The invasion of Afghanistan was not started untill October 2001. Unless you are suggesting what we all already know - that the Taliban knew what was coming even before 9/11. - In which case the earliest they knew was in the summer of 2001, a year later.

How did they know? Because Iran had given the go-ahead for airstrikes against Afghanistan months before 9/11. Russia had ok'ed it as early as March that year. Now why was that, idiot?

By your logic Opoium should be at a production of nearly nil in Taliban strongholds. Yet the facts prove that is not the case, actually the opposite.

You are peddling tired old crap and it is still as full of holes as it ever was.

Because the British are in Helmand! Jesus! Look at the point I made above.

[Toland]

Here, post reported.

[The Caped Cod]

Here, post reported.

What?

[Thac0man]

How did they know? Because Iran had given the go-ahead for airstrikes against Afghanistan months before 9/11. Russia had ok'ed it as early as March that year.

I assume you are talking about Tehrans threatened reaction to the killing of its consulate staff in Mazari Sharif in 1998, years, not months, before 9/11. And in military terms Iran is not the US. The Taliban could have repelled an Iranian invasion and indeed it would have been in the interests of the Talibans docterine to fight Iran directly.

[Thac0man]

Because the British are in Helmand! Jesus! Look at the point I made above.

The Britsh have been hold up in Helmand for years, making zero progress. In case you missed it the US is engaged in a troop surge in the province right now. Another is planned for the Kandahar region, another area where the British are present but ineffective. It is the ineffective role of British forces that has allowed the Taliban to run both Helmand and Kandahar, and foster the opium trade there. You have not and indeed cannot dispute the facts. Areas that have most Taliban activity and direct control also have a flourishing opium trade. A trade the Taliban profit from.

Mullah Omars previous edict on opium was at a time when the Taliban needed international recognition to avert imminent invasion. The Taliban, under the same leadership, has encouranged and indeed enforced opium production in areas under its control. If the edict by Mullah Omar forbid the growing of opium under Islam law, why is it allowed to continue and why does the Taliban impose a tax on it?

The the Afghan government is corrupt and that the US had no viable post invasion plan is no secret. But neither is an excuse to distort reality. Opium production is an Afghan issue and it is Kabul, not washington that has to deal with it eventually. Unless you are going to make a case for the US dictating (and being right to do so) the Afghan governments soverign laws and policy.

edit: I would also point out that Nimroz province, according to the map you posted up, is also a very high opium production area, yet according to your map has no NATO troop presense. Ta.