Homosexuals caused Srebrenica!

[Mitsui2]

The poor leadership, squabbling, and impotence of the UN, informed massively by the malign influence of British foreign policy under the Tory government, led to the circumstances that existed at the time. And even they did not 'cause' Srebrenica, the Bosnian Serb mass-murderers, goaded on by their Belgrade sponsors, caused Srebrenica. Blaming the Dutch troops, let alone any gay Dutch troops, is utterly absurd. It might or might not be a real conversation the US general had, but the very fact he used such ridiculous hearsay as an argument makes him unfit for his position.

+1

The Dutch government always played ball with the official story but the soldiers and their families were well pissed off at being stitched up. Eventually an independent Dutch tv investigation was done where all kindsa nasty stories emerged about unanswered calls for assistance, deliberately botched communications, political interference, orders for which the records mysteriously went missing, &c &c &c.

And since I remember that extremely war well as the place where the faith of a particular subset of my European generation in politics per se simply died, I can tell you that the malign hand of the British political establishment was regarded at the time as being all over the botched job that was international response to the Bosnian "war". The Tories decided that Serbia would be what they'd preferred since the 19th century - the "stonng man" of the Balkans. If that meant thousands of dead innocent men, women and children, so be it.

TA, you're scoring 100% on this one. Wish we could talk about the subject over a beer some time. It still raises my hackles when I remember it - as I try not to do.

[toxic avenger]

Thousands of Bosnian Muslims fought in the VRS, explain that. And by the way pinko, Dayton will not be altered. The best efforts of the US imperialists will be in vain despite what Biden or Teleprompter Man says. Of course nothing about the 500,000 Serbs, Jews, Roma and Gorani driven out of Krajina and Kosovo by the US junkyard dogs, the Croats and the KLA.

The Serbs and their allies were the only ones who stood in the way against the neo-liberal militarist expansionist tide that destroyed socialist Yugoslavia and so had to be demonised and destroyed like they were against the Nazis. The destruction of Yugoslavia was one of the greatest tragedies of the 20th century and eejits like you sat there and cheered on Clinton in the name of 'freedom' and 'democracy' just like you did in Afghanistan and Iraq and when Hugo Chavez was briefly overthrown.

Well the wheels are coming off the cogs in the Balkans and the Middle East and the Serbs, Afghans, Iraqis and Hugo are saying otherwise.

Enjoy

Not being a relativist who has clearly lost his soul and humanity and his brain, I have managed to oppose the Iraq and Afghan wars, remain sympathetic to Hugo Chavez (though not entirely uncritical), and yet still think the Serbs behaved like nothing other than nationalist (not socialist) genocidal lunatics. In fact I see America and the 'west' as being complicit in the reward of mass-murder by pushing the Dayton accord, and accused the Americans of being too late intervening, being a hostage to British foreign policy manoeuvring, thus not preventing hundreds and hundreds of deaths. It is you who are more in line with western policy than me, fakey commie.

Oh, and I seem to appear defending Chavez on threads here much more than you do...

[Partizan]

+1

The Dutch government always played ball with the official story but the soldiers and their families were well pissed off at being stitched up. Eventually an independent Dutch tv investigation was done where all kindsa nasty stories emerged about unanswered calls for assistance, deliberately botched communications, political interference, orders for which the records mysteriously went missing, &c &c &c.

And since I remember that extremely war well as the place where the faith of a particular subset of my European generation in politics per se simply died, I can tell you that the malign hand of the British political establishment was regarded at the time as being all over the botched job that was international response to the Bosnian "war". The Tories decided that Serbia would be what they'd preferred since the 19th century - the "stonng man" of the Balkans. If that meant thousands of dead innocent men, women and children, so be it.

TA, you're scoring 100% on this one. Wish we could talk about the subject over a beer some time. It still raises my hackles when I remember it - as I try not to do.

Some unanswered questions about Srebrenica.

The Show Goes On by Nebojsa Malic -- Antiwar.com

[Partizan]

Not being a relativist who has clearly lost his soul and humanity and his brain, I have managed to oppose the Iraq and Afghan wars, remain sympathetic to Hugo Chavez (though not entirely uncritical), and yet still think the Serbs behaved like nothing other than nationalist (not socialist) genocidal lunatics. In fact I see America and the 'west' as being complicit in the reward of mass-murder by pushing the Dayton accord, and accused the Americans of being too late intervening, being a hostage to British foreign policy manoeuvring, thus not preventing hundreds and hundreds of deaths. It is you who are more in line with western policy than me, fakey commie.

Oh, and I seem to appear defending Chavez on threads here much more than you do...

Right, on the one hand you are supporting Hugo Chavez yet on the other you are supporting US imperialist geopolitical agenda in the Balkans, the same country that attempted to overthrow and murder him. Dayton did not reward anyone, get that into your skull. It simply put a lid on things for the time being. Of course had the West not encouraged the breakup of socialist Yugoslavia in 1991 none of this would have happened.

There was no genocide in Bosnia, it was simply an internal civil war which cost the lives of 100,000 peopel from all sides. Massacres were committed by 3 sides yet you continually single out the Serbs. There you go spouting the same old tired CNN tripe.

I aint no fake Commie. I can smell a sucker a mile off. Did you oppose the attack on Yugoslavia in 1999?

[Mitsui2]

If I recall correctly Ireland didn't cover itself in glory either. Along with the other EU leaders we waited for a unified EU policy which didn't happen because nobody was prepared to take a lead. The pathetic hand-wringing and silence of our government was something to behold.

You're right about Clinton. He was the hero of the hour.

As bloody ever - never offend anyone you might get a few bob from.

I often wondered what Frank Aiken would have made of the Bosnian war

(note to modern FF adherents: Frank Aiken was a foolish figure from your parties very distant past who had a "quaint" belief in self-respect)

[Mitsui2]

There was no genocide in Bosnia

Enough said.

[Partizan]

As bloody ever - never offend anyone you might get a few bob from.

I often wondered what Frank Aiken would have made of the Bosnian war

(note to modern FF adherents: Frank Aiken was a foolish figure from your parties very distant past who had a "quaint" belief in self-respect)

Will you get your gun and off you go to fight those pesky Serbs should they rock the boat again?

[Partizan]

Enough said.

Prove it, even the ICJ said there was no proof whatsoever.

[toxic avenger]

Right, on the one hand you are supporting Hugo Chavez yet on the other you are supporting US imperialist geopolitical agenda in the Balkans, the same country that attempted to overthrow and murder him. Dayton did not reward anyone, get that into your skull. It simply put a lid on things for the time being. Of course had the West not encouraged the breakup of socialist Yugoslavia in 1991 none of this would have happened.

There was no genocide in Bosnia, it was simply an internal civil war which cost the lives of 100,000 peopel from all sides. Massacres were committed by 3 sides yet you continually single out the Serbs. There you go spouting the same old tired CNN tripe.

I aint no fake Commie. I can smell a sucker a mile off. Did you oppose the attack on Yugoslavia in 1999?

Ah, the 'civil war' lie. Instead of an act of aggression by a powerful, rabidly nationalist, armed-to-the-teeth state against an essentially defenceless, secular government, we hear the 'internal fratricide' lie again. You're not John Major, Douglas Hurd, or Malcolm Rifkind, are you? For a Commie you'd have fitted in very snugly in Whitehall back then... Plus, I don't single out the Serbs. The Croats behaved like vermin too. And, before you go there, my sympathies were with the Serbs for what the Ustashe and the Germans did to them in the 1940s up until they took a leaf out of the Nazis' book themselves...

No, of course I didn't oppose the attack in 1999. It was one of the extremely rare instances in which I grant Blair some credit. But if you want to go down the Kosovo route then start another thread, I'll argue with you there...

[Partizan]

Ah, the 'civil war' lie. Instead of an act of aggression by a powerful, rabidly nationalist, armed-to-the-teeth state against an essentially defenceless, secular government, we hear the 'internal fratricide' lie again. You're not John Major, Douglas Hurd, or Malcolm Rifkind, are you? For a Commie you'd have fitted in very snugly in Whitehall back then... Plus, I don't single out the Serbs. The Croats behaved like vermin too. And, before you go there, my sympathies were with the Serbs for what the Ustashe and the Germans did to them in the 1940s up until they took a leaf out of the Nazis' book themselves...

No, of course I didn't oppose the attack in 1999. It was one of the extremely rare instances in which I grant Blair some credit. But if you want to go down the Kosovo route then start another thread, I'll argue with you there...

I rest my case, a 'socialist' giving Tony Blair credit. You supported US imperialist aggression on Yugoslavia, yet opposed it on Iraq when the exact same false pretences were used to start a war to further the imperialist hegemonic geopolitical interests of the USA.

and you have the gall to call me a fake.

Yugoslavia was used as a text book to invade and occupy Iraq. The fake concerns for the Iraqis and Kosovans played second fiddle to the real intentions of the US war machine. You are so blind that you cannot see the link

Hugo Chavez like many real socialists opposed both invasions because he saw through the real intentions of the aggressors. The WP has been consistent in its opposition to US imperialism since Vietnam. Of course nothing about the innocent Serbs, Jews, Roma and Gorani who were kicked out of their homes by the KLA fascist scum or the defenceless Palestinians and Lebanese who continually suffer at the hands of the Zionists. Well i guess they dont appear on you moral radar.

FYI, the current Bosnian government is far from secular I can assure you.